Dr. Rickard's Zombie Motorcycle Revival - Wrist Twisters
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post #1 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 08:18 AM Thread Starter
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Dr. Rickard's Zombie Motorcycle Revival

Late last year I picked up a '77 CB 750. It sat for about six years in a barn without running. I spent a few hours cleaning it up so I could see what it needs. Both wheels were seized along with the engine. I freed up both wheels but the front caliper will need rebuilding. I found an engine with 24,000 kms on the clock. Thanks to mcromo44 for checking it out. He's been an asset to me getting this beast fixed up. A wealth of knowledge about these old machines. Before putting this engine in the frame we're going to re-do the head. I was just looking online about engine removal and came across this video. I won't be doing it this way.
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=DHvfu...%3DDHvfuGzIvq8

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post #2 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 10:58 AM
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Interesting "1 Man Method".

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post #3 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 05:20 PM
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You should post a couple pics of your progress

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post #4 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 05:44 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mr T81 View Post
You should post a couple pics of your progress
I only have one right now. I'll get some more once the snow melts away.

image-1715213826.jpg

Here's mcromo checking the valves in my new engine. Old one is almost out.

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post #5 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by rickard919 View Post
I only have one right now. I'll get some more once the snow melts away.

Attachment 24509

Here's mcromo checking the valves in my new engine. Old one is almost out.
Paying homage to The K !
Good fun, eh?
Even the points are very good for re-use, therefore so also are the condensors.

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post #6 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 07:32 PM
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Looks very cold!

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post #7 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pvster View Post
Looks very cold!
TWSS!!!. Okay, that one was way too easy...

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
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2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
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post #8 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 08:34 PM
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Awesome video.

If all else fails shake it like a baby.
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post #9 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 08:35 PM Thread Starter
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Looks very cold!
Naw. Barely below freezing. We didn't even have a heater in there.

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post #10 of 60 Old 03-05-2013, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickard919 View Post
Naw. Barely below freezing. We didn't even have a heater in there.
Grandpa has to keep his creaky joints warm so they snap less.
Young Pup rickard is nowhere near that threshold yet.
Something else, spinning off the tappet covers and feeling the lashes was like being home again.

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post #11 of 60 Old 03-06-2013, 02:48 PM Thread Starter
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Update. The old engine is now out. I already have an engine gasket set for when mcromo44 and I redo the head. Seal for the front caliper is in tomorrow and I'm currently cleaning the carbs. Once the engine and carbs are back in, I'll get a battery for it. There are a few little pieces here and there that ill need but, it's basically a complete bike.
Mcromo, the other night we were discussing exhaust. Mine has 4-2. I like that set up. Not quite as nice as 4-4 but this is my second choice.
Shout out goes out to mrt81, who got the bike. Found it in Saskatchewan, loaded it in his work truck and hauled it here and gave it to me. Thanks buddy! You'll be riding it this summer. Here's the most recent picture.

image-2277832121.jpg

That's the old engine pictured. 38,000 kms and seized.

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post #12 of 60 Old 03-06-2013, 04:03 PM
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Cool project! Please keep us posted!

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post #13 of 60 Old 03-06-2013, 05:02 PM
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Thumbs up

That new engine you got looks pretty clean.
Can't wait to see it running.
Keep the pics coming.

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post #14 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 01:12 PM Thread Starter
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image-4241432364.jpg

It's been a while since I've posted here. Time for an update. I now have a '77 and a '78. The second bike came in about 6 boxes and engine removed and in pieces. I still have the engine that mcromo44 looked over. It's together for now but is going to get a valve job very soon. I finish stripping the seized engine and now have it turning over. Between the two engines that are apart, I'm sure I can get one good runner. All three are in my basement because I don't have a heated garage. That in itself is a chore since they are just over 200lbs each. My goal is to have them reinstalled, running by the end of April this year. Road worthy by the end of May.

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post #15 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 03:51 PM
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You northern types add new meaning to the concept of checking your clearances "cold".

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post #16 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 04:24 PM
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A lot of potential in this project. Can't wait to see the end result!
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post #17 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 05:13 PM Thread Starter
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You northern types add new meaning to the concept of checking your clearances "cold".
Not as cold as it was a couple days ago.

image-4182613800.jpg

It has warmed up in the last couple days. We can't all love south of the equator. Grrrr.

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A lot of potential in this project. Can't wait to see the end result!
I can't wait either! These are the bikes I was looking at as a small boy. One I'm going to keep close to original, basically. The second might be a bit of a rat bike because I don't have two complete originals.

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post #18 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 07:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickard919
It
I can't wait either! These are the bikes I was looking at as a small boy. One I'm going to keep close to original, basically. The second might be a bit of a rat bike because I don't have two complete originals.
Can't wait to see what you do with it! An old school CB is on my bike bucket list as well ..... I dream of hopefully building a CB some day similar to this one.


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post #19 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 07:11 PM
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Cool project! Good luck with it.

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post #20 of 60 Old 02-09-2014, 07:57 PM
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I'm glad you're still working on this project! I'm hoping to ride one of these bikes this summer lol.

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post #21 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 04:52 PM
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Rickard 919, Those old 750's have allot of things that should be addressed if you are tearing down the top end. It is said yjat the cam chain tentioner has nylon wheels on it that become brittle over time like 30 or 40 years , and that there has been a number of people in the same position as you doing things right but are unaware of this issue until they get it running and it fails.
The other thing that I have heard a bit about is the rods that the head bolts go on according to many threads that I have read , they are only good once , meaning that even if they are torqued equally they still may not be right, something to do with stress.
Were both of these motors seized? If that was the case and now they are unstuck there still may be rust behind and inbetween the rings that should be dealt with. If that was the case , you can be sure that the cylinders have a rust line in them that either can be honed out or worst case rebored
How can you be sure it needs a valve job before the engine was removed? Smokey? Could just be the valve seals. You won't be getting an accurate compression test that motor if it has been seized/unfrozen....valves could be bent too or not fully closing.
I am not a 750 man But I am a 550 man who has spent a couple years reading the trails and tribulations of tons of guys with 750s. This is a great forum and the guys here are top notch but if you want to build that engine right the first time and have input from 100 guys that eat , dream and crap 750, Then you need to go here Single Over-Head Cam 4 Forums - Index . These guys will treat you right , have downloadable manuals and just tons of experience, know where to get parts and can give you ideas on what to do if you get in a jamb. Join up , it's easy , it's worth it , and you'll meet some other guys from your neck of the woods that know 750s

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post #22 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 06:13 PM
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Can't wait to see what you do with it! An old school CB is on my bike bucket list as well ..... I dream of hopefully building a CB some day similar to this one.

Is this what your bike was modeled after
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post #23 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 06:26 PM Thread Starter
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I am a member of that forum as well. I have a local guy who is a guru with these engines. Mcromo44. He was over a couple of days ago looking over the pieces I have.
Only one engine was seized. I pulled the jugs off of it to find that the rings on two pistons were indeed garbage. That one is my parts engine now. The third engine I have has a good bottom end but is missing the cam and valves. Mcromo checked the bottom on the one, top on the other and figures the two will make one good one. I have one complete engine he had looked over and saw a couple valves that weren't seating all the way. We're going to take it apart and lap them. He had mentioned replacing the cam chain adjuster/guide while its apart. Silly not to do it. He never mentioned anything about the head bolts. Hopefully he chimes in here about it. If not, I'll call him before reassembly. I just finished pulling all the valves and am cleaning up the head.
I appreciate your input with this bike. I've never been this far inside one of these before. It's all fairly basic but there are a ton of little things in there.

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post #24 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 07:17 PM
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Good deal , I didn't recognize either of your handles on that forum. One of the best things on that forum besides the people, is the search bar, you have a question ,punch it in and get a handful of answers from previous posts and see how everyone else dealt with that issue saves time ,offers more information and enlightening ideas.
All of my 550 engine parts are interchangable with no real differences, the 750 seems to be similar but different, some changes ,subtle differences have occurred over the years as posted here
CB750 K and F engine Interchangeability + Upgrades that may or may not effect your build depending on the years of your motors, at least you will be able to find interchangeability issues and improved parts so you know what you are putting together works or works better. Pretty neat.
The head bolts, and rods that lead into the top case, 550 guys don't change them at rebuild time but, it seems 750 guys do and claim they must. It's that kind of inside information I was talking about, I wouldn't have thought to change them out being a 550 man , and when I get a hold of a 750 now, I won't be totally in the dark about it.
And there is a member there that makes a breakaway frame set up for the 2 lower bars of the 3 bar spine,that would make engine removal and install a dream.
I'm looking forward to your build. And yes those motors are heavy, do you have an injury free plan to get a completed engine back up stairs? Please post allot, like the pics, there's still plenty of winter to go.

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post #25 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickard919 View Post
I am a member of that forum as well. I have a local guy who is a guru with these engines. Mcromo44. He was over a couple of days ago looking over the pieces I have.
Only one engine was seized. I pulled the jugs off of it to find that the rings on two pistons were indeed garbage. That one is my parts engine now. The third engine I have has a good bottom end but is missing the cam and valves. Mcromo checked the bottom on the one, top on the other and figures the two will make one good one. I have one complete engine he had looked over and saw a couple valves that weren't seating all the way. We're going to take it apart and lap them. He had mentioned replacing the cam chain adjuster/guide while its apart. Silly not to do it. He never mentioned anything about the head bolts. Hopefully he chimes in here about it. If not, I'll call him before reassembly. I just finished pulling all the valves and am cleaning up the head.
I appreciate your input with this bike. I've never been this far inside one of these before. It's all fairly basic but there are a ton of little things in there.
Guru is a bit much.
Anyway, as to the case studs that clamp the head/cylinder/block stock.
The stock studs are perfectly good for a stock or mildly modified engine.
The so called studs issued evolved from people over torquing them in an effort to get the head gaskets to seal better, when in fact the studs were not the problem.
Over torquing them was.
Plus improper prep or bad parts.
This was particularly so with the pre mid 75 head gaskets, which did not have the TSB# 42 revised head gasket design (that is not backward compatible !).
My experience was that flat block and head surfaces, lightly swirl dressed with 400 against a carpenters plane (blade out of course) , treated with metal prep, cleaned with lacquer thinner or acetone, then compounded with Hylamar, simply would not leak or sweat. Torque to upper limit. Let it sit overnight. Back off and retorque to upper limit.
Install engine.
And don't forget hidden 4 small bolts under the cam towers .......................

Engine removal tip.
Remove the exhaust port stubs.
File down the upper flange area of the forward right hand mount.
You'd be amazed at how much more room this yields.

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post #26 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 07:33 PM
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mcromo44, are you saying that all this stud changing has been an overkill activity? Or just good practice to change them out because you never know what the PO has done to them? Do they show stress from over torqueing? How will I be able to tell if they have not been abused and can be re used? RB

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post #27 of 60 Old 02-13-2014, 07:47 PM Thread Starter
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See what I mean!^^

I haven't thought of how I'm getting the engines out of the basement yet. Two were complete going down so I think the same way. Pick them up and carry them. Two guys can manage one fairly easily. The trick is to tell a friend you need their help. Just don't tell them for what until the get over.
You're right about the search on that forum. I don't think I've even posted there. Same user name btw. I'm just a lurker, for now.
So far the biggest trouble I've come across was removing the valves. I bought a spring tool but found it to be useless. Instead I used c-clamps to compress the springs with good success. Other than the first one. Got the spring mostly compressed, went to look at it from a different angle and, boing. Both springs, retainer and split collars fly into the ceiling. Found the springs and both collars but still searching for the retainer. I was pre-warned about this the day before. Also, you should never have the spring aimed toward you face. Just saying. More pictures to come.

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post #28 of 60 Old 02-14-2014, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rb550four View Post
mcromo44, 1 are you saying that all this stud changing has been an overkill activity? 2 Or just good practice to change them out because you never know what the PO has done to them? 3 Do they show stress from over torqueing? 4 How will I be able to tell if they have not been abused and can be re used? RB
1
Yes

2
Very bad practice if not needed, as time and money is wasted plus risk of botching a removal from the upper case half.

3
If threads are good and they "build torque" as measured by a torque wrench, they are OK.
(Build torque means the measured torque reads as increasing with more wrench movement.)
Not building torque can mean threads ,stud, or case threading all in terms of prior damage.

4
Most important is to know the engine history, but for a 40 year old engine that will be more a rarity.
Visually examine the parts.
Check the nut on stud thread feel re clearance, unloaded that is.
Make sure the washers being used are correct parts and not low grade substitutions perhaps butchered on a grinder to make fit.
Do a dummy build with no rings, no gaskets, check the torque build characteristic.
IF stud changes are needed, use OEM studs for stock builds and low power builds.
Studs are not an issue unless it is a high power race build for racing (high power build actually generating high power that can't be replicated by road use)

Hope this helps you, keeping in mind I don't know your particulars.

Also, there was a head gasket change in the K4 production run and see TSB # 39 of Feb 74. They went to latex coated. Early stuff was not coated at all, all my work was with uncoated gaskets.

If you plan to use it hard, consider the revised shift drum per TSB # 40 of April 74. I think this was the fix for the tranny's that were susceptible to popping out of 4th under certain conditions. There was a interim fix that involved a deposit of braze on the internal shift linkage. My bike was one of them treated that way. Looking back, I think that rider technique, or rather - lack of, had much to do with it.

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post #29 of 60 Old 02-16-2014, 03:29 PM
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Thank you for answering so completely. I have suspected over building by many with stock builds for a while , but understood this behavior years ago as a very thorough build . Then recently everyone who has picked up a 750 was changing out studs as a mandatory practice . Must be the latest craze.
I not sure why I believed it was a mandatory operation, perhaps, it was because others believe it to be true.
Like I said before , I'm a 550 guy, and 550 guys don't change them out on a rebuild... unless they need to.
Thanks

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post #30 of 60 Old 02-17-2014, 02:25 PM Thread Starter
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Update with pictures.



image-4184387404.jpg

This is how I got the bike.


image-598080912.jpg



image-1401032081.jpg



image-2940509721.jpg

Here it is what i did today. I was going to fix it to original but Helimech changed my mind by posting that picture. Thanks Heli, for helping me spend my money.
So far it's only mocked up but the front is basically done.

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post #31 of 60 Old 02-17-2014, 04:54 PM
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Get a matching rear wheel on there and that thing will look sweet.

What's your plan for the rear seat area of the bike? cafe racer round-ish back end or streetfighter pointy tail?

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post #32 of 60 Old 02-17-2014, 06:32 PM Thread Starter
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What's your plan for the rear seat area of the bike? cafe racer round-ish back end or streetfighter pointy tail?
I have the rear rim that matches but no rubber to go on it. I need to keep it as a roller for now. I think I want to go with a cafe racer seat, it would look the best.

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post #33 of 60 Old 02-17-2014, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
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Here it is what i did today. I was going to fix it to original but Helimech changed my mind by posting that picture. Thanks Heli, for helping me spend my money.
So far it's only mocked up but the front is basically done.

Anytime buddy! Should be pretty sweet ...... stock is overated BTW.

There seems to be a cheap project bike epidemic on WT lately! I am loving all these new builds.

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post #34 of 60 Old 02-17-2014, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
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Is this what your bike was modeled after
Missed this earlier ...... Wolf you might be on to something.

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post #35 of 60 Old 02-17-2014, 07:24 PM
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Great project, tanks looks to be in good condition. Get a matching rear wheel and it's gonna be smokin'.

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post #36 of 60 Old 02-18-2014, 06:20 PM
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Update with pictures.



This is how I got the bike.



Attachment 48986


Here it is what i did today. I was going to fix it to original but Helimech changed my mind by posting that picture. Thanks Heli, for helping me spend my money.
So far it's only mocked up but the front is basically done.
Hey, that front end looks familiar for some reason. Hmm....


'96 DR650, '01 SV650, '10 Aprilia Tuono 1000R
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post #37 of 60 Old 02-18-2014, 06:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Hey, that front end looks familiar for some reason. Hmm....
Yup, you nailed it. SV650. Hopefully I can get the rear wheel on there this weekend.

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post #38 of 60 Old 02-18-2014, 06:34 PM
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I think it'll look good. Are you going to have to make spacers to get it to line up correctly?

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post #39 of 60 Old 02-18-2014, 06:48 PM Thread Starter
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Not too sure about the spacers yet. I'm sure they'll have to be custom made ones. First thing I will be doing the axle. The CB uses a 20mm and the SV has a 17mm. I'm not sure if is just a matter of changing the bearings and wheel spacer. It might be a bit of work.

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post #40 of 60 Old 02-19-2014, 05:16 PM
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I see the sv650 has a mono shock swing arm
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/j...3/DSCN0216.jpg

Will you be changing that swing arm or welding the axle slot tighter to accept smaller diameter axle? Are the swing arms close in size at the pivot bolt?...That would be a nice application if possible, but does it get in the way of the oil tank...if you'll be keeping it in stock position...and you are planning to run the electrics under a seat cowl over the hoop right? I've seen some guys stuff some of the electrics in between the triple framed spine to save space under the rear cowl for a decent sized battery instead of a wimpy little race battery since it's not a track bike.
This could be a lot of fun.

rb550four is offline  
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