Running rich (is this normal) - Wrist Twisters
 
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post #1 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 06:18 AM Thread Starter
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Running rich (is this normal)

I have noticed that even after a long ride that the motor smells like its running very rich and im going through gas like a V8 ....im only geting about 120 miles from a tank of gas which is only about 24-25 mpg , is this normal for these 919's , i do ride quite hard and use the full rev range of the engine as much as possible but even so it seems kind of excessive..... any thoughts???

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post #2 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 06:47 AM
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sounds pretty bad to me, I've been getting mid 40's with normal driving. Still need the breakin service so I haven't been running it that hard.

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post #3 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 07:06 AM
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Run it hard and millage goes in the dumper. Try this, check out the millage on a tank of gas without the heavy throttle twisting. Restrain yourself, yah I know, it's not easy. BTW: All 919's run rich with the factory ECM.

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post #4 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterMike View Post
Run it hard and millage goes in the dumper. Try this, check out the millage on a tank of gas without the heavy throttle twisting. Restrain yourself, yah I know, it's not easy. BTW: All 919's run rich with the factory ECM.
+1


Mileage as low as yours seems to indicate a problem, though. I know from fact that when I ride my ZX10R hard for a tankfull, I get about 30. And this is some pretty hard running with 3/4 and more throttle. This is a consistent fact on the 10R, with good mileage upwards of 35-38.

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post #5 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 07:38 AM
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A lot of people here have gotten that low, including myself. Pretty normal if you have been flogging her like you say.

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post #6 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 09:26 AM
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"Conservatively rich"

Quote:
Originally Posted by rearwheel View Post
I have noticed that even after a long ride that the motor smells like its running very rich and im going through gas like a V8 ....im only geting about 120 miles from a tank of gas which is only about 24-25 mpg , is this normal for these 919's , i do ride quite hard and use the full rev range of the engine as much as possible but even so it seems kind of excessive..... any thoughts???
Honda seems to have written the fuel map to deliver a very rich mix above 7,500 RPM and 2/3 to 3/4 throttle to help cool the pistons in a motor they assume will be used predominantly in the 5,000 to 6,000 range, with occasional forays into the nether regions of the tach. The advantage to this is the powerband accentuates this behaviour. Frankly, the 919 is not an R6, which requires strangling the throttle to get anywhere, so habitually keeping it above 7,000 RPM indicates you bought the wrong bike! It seems to me you should buy a 1000rr for frequent track days to get your rocks off, and ride the 919 more in keeping with its strengths on the street, which will not only make you a better rider overall, but will get mileage in the low 40s, and is also one hell of a lot safer!

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post #7 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 09:34 AM
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I've played around with the gas mileage on my 9er a bunch. Gone through several tanks riding hard, accelerating hard, etc, and I get about what you're seeing, 120-130 miles on about 4 gallons. On "normal driving" (mostly mild with spurts into the higher RPM), I'll get about 150-160 on about 4 gallons. Pure highway, I've seen as high as 180, but that's rare for me.

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post #8 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 09:43 AM
 
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With normal riding, I was getting to about 110 before the fuel light came on. After I put on my PCIII (Sato map) I can get to about 135 before the light comes on. Mine is the CA model, which I have heard that some bikes come with slightly smaller tanks compared to the 49-state bike. Not sure if this is the case with the 919 though.

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post #9 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmelnick View Post
I've played around with the gas mileage on my 9er a bunch. Gone through several tanks riding hard, accelerating hard, etc, and I get about what you're seeing, 120-130 miles on about 4 gallons. On "normal driving" (mostly mild with spurts into the higher RPM), I'll get about 150-160 on about 4 gallons. Pure highway, I've seen as high as 180, but that's rare for me.

Get the same results and I've checked my odometer against my GPS and even though the Speedo is off, the odometers are pretty dang close to GPS readings.

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post #10 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmelnick View Post
I've played around with the gas mileage on my 9er a bunch. Gone through several tanks riding hard, accelerating hard, etc, and I get about what you're seeing, 120-130 miles on about 4 gallons. On "normal driving" (mostly mild with spurts into the higher RPM), I'll get about 150-160 on about 4 gallons. Pure highway, I've seen as high as 180, but that's rare for me.
Agreed. That's the same results I get.

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post #11 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 11:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmelnick View Post
I've played around with the gas mileage on my 9er a bunch. Gone through several tanks riding hard, accelerating hard, etc, and I get about what you're seeing, 120-130 miles on about 4 gallons. On "normal driving" (mostly mild with spurts into the higher RPM), I'll get about 150-160 on about 4 gallons. Pure highway, I've seen as high as 180, but that's rare for me.
+3 i think!

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post #12 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 12:40 PM
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Gas mileage

At 4,000 plus miles, I still get 48-52 on peaceful rural rides, and a little less on rippers. I re-set my trip #1 every day, and trip#2 every fill-up. I'm not writing a book, it's just when you retire you can take time to do lil extras that a working stiff finds time consuming. I saw 172 miles one time and the light never came on, I do hope it works.

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post #13 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 03:12 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks guys it makes me feel a little better knowing its a combination of my right hand and the map ..... its not that i do excessive speed all the time its more the terrain i ride in i think.... lots of conners and not to far appart so i dont bother changing up gears as you would on a highway... i spend a lot of time in second and third just to save on heaps of gear changes , and i tend to take the back roads rather than the main highways as they have more of a fun factor . guess i'll have to fill up and do some more sedate riding on main roads and keep the throttle more constant and see what it will really do on a tankful..... i spose i can handle that for a few hours lol
And as for buying the wrong bike I DONT THINK SO ...... my 9er is the best damn fun i've had in years and im not letin it go for any reason..... But in saying that i have been thinking about nipping out and geting me a zx14 to handle a few of the touring duties and two up stuff

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post #14 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rearwheel View Post
Thanks guys it makes me feel a little better its more the terrain i ride in i think.... lots of conners and not to far appart so i dont bother changing up gears as you would on a highway .... i tend to take the back roads rather than the main highways as they have more of a fun factor .... And as for buying the wrong bike I DONT THINK SO ...... my 9er is the best damn fun i've had in years and im not letin it go for any reason
Well, that puts a different light on it! I take it you ride Saddle Road in preference to the 3 to get to the Palmerston North area from Woodville -- I would too! Just try 3rd and 4th instead of 2nd and 3rd, and you will probably notice a big difference in mileage. As it happens, I'm in the same boat, just on the opposite side of the globe (look up Piuma Road in Malibu, California using Google Maps to see the beginning and end of my daily commute. A 3rd & 4th gear barrel of serious fun, and I have a huge grin on my face when I get to work!) So I apologize for the "wrong bike" comment -- It's perfect for your ride.

Rob

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post #15 of 27 Old 09-19-2007, 08:21 PM
 
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I was just thinking about my mileage just the other day and wondering: "Why has my mileage dropped about 5mpg?"

I'm not sure exactly when this happened, but, it seems like it changed around the time of my 12000 mile service. I know the shop did a lot of stuff at that time, but not sure if any of it would affect the fuel delivery, mixture, tune, etc. From what I remember, I was getting about 42 mpg before 12000 miles and about 37 mpg after.

Any thoughts?

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post #16 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 04:46 AM Thread Starter
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Yep Rob your right on the money with saddle road , its a blast and i ride it every day , plus vinagar hill and the parapara's both also similar to the saddle , i find straight roads boring , if you want to check out the other roads the parapara's is north of wanganui on the road to ratahi and vinagar hill is between ashurst and our No1 main highway just north of hunterville ....... both fantastic roads for a bike ......... and prolly the main reason for my lousy gas milage lol.... cheers

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post #17 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robtharalson View Post
Well, that puts a different light on it! I take it you ride Saddle Road in preference to the 3 to get to the Palmerston North area from Woodville -- I would too! Just try 3rd and 4th instead of 2nd and 3rd, and you will probably notice a big difference in mileage. As it happens, I'm in the same boat, just on the opposite side of the globe (look up Piuma Road in Malibu, California using Google Maps to see the beginning and end of my daily commute. A 3rd & 4th gear barrel of serious fun, and I have a huge grin on my face when I get to work!) So I apologize for the "wrong bike" comment -- It's perfect for your ride.

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post #18 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 10:11 AM
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If people are getting 30mpg out of their 919's that's just the shiits. That is Superhawk mileage and nothing to be proud of...... rather be pissed off at!
Gotta be something lurking and causing this problem. What are some reports of bone stock bike mileage? Get some data in here and lay it on the table in the War Room. Have the caterer get some coffee and pastries to boot. We may be at this thing all night.

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post #19 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Bigdaa View Post
If people are getting 30mpg out of their 919's that's just the shiits. That is Superhawk mileage and nothing to be proud of...... rather be pissed off at!
Gotta be something lurking and causing this problem. What are some reports of bone stock bike mileage? Get some data in here and lay it on the table in the War Room. Have the caterer get some coffee and pastries to boot. We may be at this thing all night.
The faster you spin the motor, the faster the gas goes. Simple. Look at the attachment FlyCatcher posted: the first and last third of my daily commute, and I average 42 to 45 MPG on my bone stock '02 despite topping 100 MPH on a daily basis. I just keep it below 7,000 RPM.

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post #20 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 04:25 PM
 
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yeah, but I keep mine below 7000 rpm (except on very short and very occasional moments) and i'm only getting about 37-38 mpg. the bike is "bone stock" unless you consider the new chain and sprockets that are not OEM but are the same size as original. I'm rolling on Conti Road Attack tires front and rear with correct air pressure (or close to it). my commute is a mix of city and highway (1/2-n-1/2). I don't rocket of the line or anything and rarely drive over 80 mph (just shy of the 5k rpm mark). could something have been changed when the dealer did the 12,000 mile service?

also, you guys that are getting 45 mpg, what size rear sprocket are you running? has everyone on this site except me re-mapped their PCIII (i'm really showing my ignorance, now!). likewise, for the folks that are getting horrible mileage, have you all done performance mods to your bikes as well?

Just curious.

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post #21 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Gringodelcibao View Post
yeah, but I keep mine below 7000 rpm (except on very short and very occasional moments) and i'm only getting about 37-38 mpg. my commute is a mix of city and highway (1/2-n-1/2). I don't rocket of the line or anything and rarely drive over 80 mph (just shy of the 5k rpm mark). could something have been changed when the dealer did the 12,000 mile service? Just curious.
There is a distinct possibility the service was a tune down instead of up. A 13% drop in mileage is significant, especially if your riding has not changed in any substantial way. While it's possible they overadjusted a valve (assuming that was part of the service), more likely one of the spark plug gaps was closed up during installation, weakening the spark in that cylinder. This is more likely in the #2 or 3 cylinders due to access issues. I strongly recommend you take it back and have it rechecked -- like as not, they will swap out the plug, then tell you they couldn't find a problem: at least it will be taken care of! Alternatively, you could check them yourself. The only downside to this is if you make a mistake you only have yourself to blame. Anyway, I hope this is of some help, and good luck with this. By the way, when I say "bone stock," I mean it (except for tires).

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post #22 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 06:01 PM
 
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What's the big concern about gas mileage? If you run out, buy more. If you are having fun, who cares.

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post #23 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 06:13 PM
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What's the big concern about gas mileage? If you run out, buy more. If you are having fun, who cares.
Exactly. Post away on your results, but I don't expect mine to be the same. I haven't ridden with you and you haven't ridden with me. Altitude, agressive riding, temperature, state of tune, mods, etc. all play a factor. Your chain maintenance can lose a couple MPG.

I've ridden at 100 MPH for an entire tank through Wyoming with a headwind. Did I get good gas mileage. Uh,.....no. Did I care.....uh ......no.

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post #24 of 27 Old 09-20-2007, 06:50 PM
 
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thanks,rob. the plugs sound like an "easy" and inexpensive place to start looking for my lost mpg's. they were replaced at the 8,000 mile service (which is probably the one I've been recalling and referring to as the 12k service. i'll give that a try and let you know what i find.

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post #25 of 27 Old 09-22-2007, 05:46 PM
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last time i was out riding i had to get on interstate for about 90 miles to get to some really good twisties got 110 miles on full tank b4 i needed gas. kinda crappy, but didnt care about that. what sucked is i finished off my second rear tire this season oh well whats one more

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post #26 of 27 Old 03-17-2008, 01:42 PM
 
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FYI Extra resistance anywhere in the intake air temperature circuit would make it run rich as would any kind of vacuum leak going to the MAP sensor or at the throttle bodies. Inspection procedures are in the service manual.

A thermostat that was opening to early or stuck open would do cause this too. Check the temp gauge for normal readings.

A coolant temperature sensor reading low or low coolant level are also possible causes. That sensor reading is what gives you the extra fuel needed to start & run the bike when cold, not the "choke" lever.

The bike would still start & run fine with any of these problems. Trouble codes might not be set.

Low tire pressure is the most likely answer to low MPG issues though. Officially they are 36Front & 42Rear.

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post #27 of 27 Old 03-17-2008, 05:08 PM
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if you had a problem, you'd have a driveability symptom and/or a FI light on the dash.

if it starts, idles, and runs well (and you didn't say otherwise so i'm assuming it is/does) and the FI light isn't lit, then it's you.

your blend of fuel in your area MAY have some affect here too, but foremost, the bike is okay.

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