POWER COMMANDER QUESTION - Wrist Twisters
 
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post #1 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 10:09 AM Thread Starter
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POWER COMMANDER QUESTION

I hope this is not like an oil thread but here goes:

The 919 that is not mine yet has my butt on it most of the time has Yosh slip ons and block off plates. The throttle is touchy or twichy or laymans terms is not so smooth.

Would a PC3 help this out or is there other choices to go with that have proved to be successful? I do not expect much if any hp gains but a little would not hurt.

One last question and this is about cams. What other cams from other bikes will go into 919? I am really just looking for a little more intake cam.

Thanks Much -- Bobby

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post #2 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 10:14 AM
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hey bobby, the smoothness of throttle input is the main benefit of installing a PCIII and getting a custom map. you'll love it! DO IT. hit up LDH for good deals on PCIII

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post #3 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 11:23 AM
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the Powercommander is all about better throttle response and a more linear power delivery.

If you want more power buy a different bike...

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post #4 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
I hope this is not like an oil thread but here goes:

The 919 that is not mine yet has my butt on it most of the time has Yosh slip ons and block off plates. The throttle is touchy or twichy or laymans terms is not so smooth.

Would a PC3 help this out or is there other choices to go with that have proved to be successful? I do not expect much if any hp gains but a little would not hurt.

One last question and this is about cams. What other cams from other bikes will go into 919? I am really just looking for a little more intake cam.

Thanks Much -- Bobby
Why more intake if the throttle bodies have to stay the same ?
Instead of a another cam, it might be possible to get adjustable cam sprockets like are available for the 900 RR cams.
In that case, you could retard the stock cam a few degrees, and be able to tinker tune change things.
Also, you could shave the deck and or head, get another point of static ratio, and be able to get your timing back.
More cam timing without more static ratio does not make sense.
That said in terms of what the 919 static is, and what it isn't.
But, like LDH so succinctly said, if you want more power, get another bike.
Exponential expense on 919 power will at best yield incremental gain and loss of its nice fat flat torque curve.

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post #5 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 12:52 PM
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playing with cams on the 919 is pointless... no true drop in aftermarket cams out there and the ones that kind of work (900rr cams) need mods etc to get them to work.

if your wanting more power.... like LDH said... get another bike. cus its very hard to squeeze extra naturally aspirated hp out of it... ask bucky... bored, decked, 900rr cams and i think he was only making +10-15hp.

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post #6 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 01:35 PM
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Initially my biggest gripe about the 919 was the wiplash inducing throttle. I had just got back on a bike after having not ridden for a couple of years. I noticed that after several months of riding the throttle had seemed to improve quite a bit. I suspect in reality my reflexes, muscle control (balance) and my throttle control had all been sharpened.

By the time I got around to installing the PC3 I had ZERO complaints regarding the throttle. That being said, soon as the PC3 was installed beams of light shot down from the heavens, blue birds starting flitting about and angels began to sing. Poorboy also took off down the street on my bike, with the front wheel in the air... (I did swap over to a 4-1 low exhaust at the same time though)

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post #7 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 01:42 PM Thread Starter
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I will use the ZRX Kawasaki cam explanation but 1st back in the day with the air cooled 900 and 1000 kaws for street use we would stick a bigger intake cam in and it produced better midrange and did not need 7000 up for power.

ZRX1100 with full pipe and jet kit nets 113 to 115 hp. If ZX11 ninja cams are added then it goes wild -- above 7000 and hurtin below BUT with just the ZX11 ninja intake you get 4 more hp and all in the mid. No hurt on the bottom and no waiting for 7000.
ZRX1200 with a ZZR1200 intake does the same.

1 needle clip adjustment is all that needs done (sea level to 500 FT) to do this.

Thought if there was something simular with the 919 it is only time on my side.

LDH the 919 is the slowest bike in my gayrage and this does hurt to say but it is also one of the funnest to play on in the gayrage (and out of the gayrage).

That just left a bad taste in the mouth - kinda like chewin on a Honda turd.....

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post #8 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 01:45 PM Thread Starter
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BOCO the only smoothness to the throttle is an educated right hand. One just gets used to adjusting themselves to the bike they are riding at the time.

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post #9 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 01:52 PM
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Yoshis without a PC3 and I have no issues with the throttle.

More power ................ slot a 954 engine in there. The engine mounts differ but I'm sure with a bit of thought .....

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post #10 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
I will use the ZRX Kawasaki cam explanation but 1st back in the day with the air cooled 900 and 1000 kaws for street use we would stick a bigger intake cam in and it produced better midrange and did not need 7000 up for power.

ZRX1100 with full pipe and jet kit nets 113 to 115 hp. If ZX11 ninja cams are added then it goes wild -- above 7000 and hurtin below BUT with just the ZX11 ninja intake you get 4 more hp and all in the mid. No hurt on the bottom and no waiting for 7000.
ZRX1200 with a ZZR1200 intake does the same.

1 needle clip adjustment is all that needs done (sea level to 500 FT) to do this.

Thought if there was something simular with the 919 it is only time on my side.
lol Bobby, respectfully, even *I* am not foolish enough to compare a carbureted bike to a fuel injected bike. I can play jack-off with washers and such in the 599, but it's carbed - that's how it goes. Nevermind comparing 1100 cc to 919 cc and what the cam profile *might* be like, in stock form, on the 1100 ... it's not the same.

But since you wanna talk stories ... (hope I don't f-up your thread) ...

This past Tuesday I took the 919 out. I turned the key to prime the pump, hit the starter and she woke up after a *brief moment* of cranking, like 3 seconds.

Today I took out the 599. I turned the key to prime the pump, hit the starter and ... hit the starter and, reduced choke and hit the starter, more choke and hit the starter and ... no choke and hit the starter ........ after almost 10 minute she finally, less-than-enthusiastically, woke up, like from a deeeeeeeep hibernation.

C'mon, man, really?


Now, that being said, I would NOT shrug a shoulder to +10 - 15 hp. That's about 10 - 15% gain. It's not like it'll cost $1000 (even in Canadian $!) to get it. If we were talking about a 200 hp engine and a 20 - 30 hp gain then many people would say "that's not bad" and go for it. Question is ... where's Bucky?!?!?!? Pipe up bud!

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post #11 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 06:07 PM
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ya know bobby, if you really want hp increase.... get a turbo kit. they got em for the 919.

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post #12 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 08:19 PM Thread Starter
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So who else here has tried it? What is the worse that happens if I ever try it - fail? Just because it is fuel injected does not mean one cannot play around and besides all I am looking for is a better running toy.

Anyway they were only questions out of curiosity that I will not bring up again.

Later -- Bobby

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post #13 of 39 Old 02-09-2012, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
So who else here has tried it? What is the worse that happens if I ever try it - fail? Just because it is fuel injected does not mean one cannot play around and besides all I am looking for is a better running toy.

Anyway they were only questions out of curiosity that I will not bring up again.

Later -- Bobby
I get the impression you have at least handle on things.
So, if you want the fun and satisfaction of going after some more, go for it.
As long as you have reasonable expectations of what the results will be, we'd hate to see you happy.
I looked at from a chassis point of view.
Far greater gains can be had in that department, and much more easily.
I probably went as far chassis wise, as you are contemplating for your engine.
So, you have some company - just in a different form.

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post #14 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 04:24 AM Thread Starter
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MC there is nothing wrong with setting the chassis except that I am a less than average rider with conerphobia. If I have to lean the bike in a corner then I slow down so I go with what is comfy to me which is a little faster and no corners if possible.

Past the PC I probably stop anyway and as I said it was only questions.

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post #15 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 10:24 AM
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Never mind the fact that Honda already tuned the 919 for midrange anyway... :P

Also, seriously, get over that corner phobia. I realize that your precious Kawasaki have taught you to fear corners, but this is a Honda. :P

However, if you have aftermarket pipes, you should probably get a PC3 just to correct the issues they bring. I.E., the fuel map then being off, etc., etc.

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post #16 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 10:53 AM
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Why do you want more power if you have "Cornerphobia"? Maybe you should get less power and learn your corners. I hear the CBR250RRs are only $3K

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post #17 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by 07919Dave View Post
Why do you want more power if you have "Cornerphobia"? Maybe you should get less power and learn your corners. I hear the CBR250RRs are only $3K
Because with a sportbike you are going to get your adrenaline rush through either acceleration or from the corners. If you can't do one you settle for the other.

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post #18 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:13 AM
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Ooooohhhhhhh, I guess I am different. I get it from both......

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post #19 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:18 AM
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bobby, seriously, if you'd consider a cam swap for the 919, give some serious thought to the turbo!

http://919turbo.com/

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post #20 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:20 AM Thread Starter
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Because with a sportbike you are going to get your adrenaline rush through either acceleration or from the corners. If you can't do one you settle for the other.

Thank you LDH and I wish I could have said it that well

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post #21 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:21 AM
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Ooooohhhhhhh, I guess I am different. I get it from both......
Not on a 919 you don't LOL

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post #22 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:24 AM Thread Starter
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bobby, seriously, if you'd consider a cam swap for the 919, give some serious thought to the turbo!

The 919 will not be a performance bike for me but I am not against a little bit of tweeking here and there. I just want it to be a little better running than the average 919 and if I didn't have to split cases to put pistons in I would be looking for a set of 12 or 12.5 for it.


You would be surprised how well a ZRX1100 2mm over with 13.0 pistons run.

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post #23 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 11:27 AM Thread Starter
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Dave I have always been scared of corners and in a little over 40 years of having bikes it has not gone away. I will use more of my chicken strips heating a tire up for drag racing than I will use on a corner.

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post #24 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:00 PM
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Not on a 919 you don't LOL
LOL

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
Dave I have always been scared of corners and in a little over 40 years of having bikes it has not gone away. I will use more of my chicken strips heating a tire up for drag racing than I will use on a corner.
Hey to each their own. Right now at this point in my life and riding life the 919 has plenty of straight line go and gets as deep in to the corners that I can take it. This season coming up I plan on taking it deeper in to corners and I plan on one or two track days with it. Now in five years when I go out and seriously look at true sport bikes LDH's comment above with ring true for me.

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post #25 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:13 PM
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Dave I have always been scared of corners and in a little over 40 years of having bikes it has not gone away. I will use more of my chicken strips heating a tire up for drag racing than I will use on a corner.
I can almost guarantee this has more to do with proper technique and body positioning than anything.

You probably at some point had a butt-clencher when too hot into a corner and now your body is reacting (stiffly, probably) when in similar circumstances.

The only way around that is to change your technique; loosen up the shoulders, get the butt shifted on the seat, get proper position on the bike so the bike isn't as far leaned over as you 'think' it should be. Let the weight of your body help pull the bike through the corner.

I am by no means an excellent corner carver, but I am at least getting over the above phobia myself by forcing new (correct) technique whenever possible.

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post #26 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:30 PM
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Them corners skeer me too....

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post #27 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:31 PM
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Them corners skeer me too....
.....whatever..... stop picking on us little guys, ....

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post #28 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:42 PM
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"I can almost guarantee this has more to do with proper technique and body positioning than anything."

Can't we blame some of it on the rear shock?

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post #29 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:49 PM
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.....whatever..... stop picking on us little guys, ....

Naw man, I've never had butt-pucker moments while street riding like I have on a 919... I mean lets face it, to ride one effectively and keep up with proper sport bikes you are just throwing it into a turn and praying that it sticks as it doesn't yield any level of usable feedback whatsoever. Unless of course you take into account the audible screech of the foot pegs grinding down as a warning


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post #30 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by LDH View Post
Naw man, I've never had butt-pucker moments while street riding like I have on a 919... I mean lets face it, to ride one effectively and keep up with proper sport bikes you are just throwing it into a turn and praying that it sticks as it doesn't yield any level of usable feedback whatsoever. Unless of course you take into account the audible screech of the foot pegs grinding down as a warning

Key words there being 'keeping up with proper sport bikes', which the 919 isn't.

I never intend to 'keep up' using sub-standard equipment, I just want to corner better on what I have.

That's not to say I wouldn't mind having a S1000RR in my gayrage, though...

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post #31 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by g00gl3it View Post
Key words there being 'keeping up with proper sport bikes', which the 919 isn't.

I never intend to 'keep up' using sub-standard equipment, I just want to corner better on what I have.

That's not to say I wouldn't mind having a S1000RR in my gayrage, though...
Agree with this whole statement. I love the part about the S1000RR.

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post #32 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 01:30 PM
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Because with a sportbike you are going to get your adrenaline rush through either acceleration or from the corners. If you can't do one you settle for the other.
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Ooooohhhhhhh, I guess I am different. I get it from both......
Quote:
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Not on a 919 you don't LOL
Sometimes I'm absolutely amazed at the attitudes about 919 power and handling in here.

While it doesn't have as much as a lot of the performance type bikes, It still has far more power and better handling than most riders I've seen can/will use.

Most guys I've seen riding (along with 3-4 919 riders) on skyline (hwy 35) don't even come close to its performance limits. And as for the guys that have the latest/greatest/most powerful sportbikes (with 2 inch chicken strips), they are effing hilarious.

Bottom line. The 919 has enough power to give a rush to 95% of the riders out there. While I think a lot of riders think they can take advantage of more power, they usually cant.

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post #33 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 01:37 PM
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Sometimes I'm absolutely amazed at the attitudes about 919 power and handling in here.

While it doesn't have as much as a lot of the performance type bikes, It still has far more power and better handling than most riders I've seen can/will use.

Most guys I've seen riding (along with 3-4 919 riders) on skyline (hwy 35) don't even come close to its performance limits. And as for the guys that have the latest/greatest/most powerful sportbikes (with 2 inch chicken strips), they are effing hilarious.

Bottom line. The 919 has enough power to give a rush to 95% of the riders out there. While I think a lot of riders think they can take advantage of more power, they usually cant.

I think the 919 is about as perfectly matched for power as you can get. It is the perfect streetbike and the chassis really can't make use of any more power or grip for that matter than it copes with already. Having said that it is underpowered period. It's broad torque curve makes it usable and it is definitely both functional & fun, but it is far from exhilarating when you twist the grip...

As far as chicken strips go I will be the first to admit I had some on my 919, but you had to look on the front tire to find them


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post #34 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 01:43 PM
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Underpowered, for the 5% or less guys out there like you LDH, yes. Definitely not for most riders tho. If someone cant even come close to utilizing whats there, its over-powered if anything. And I think most riders fall into the second category.

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post #35 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 01:58 PM Thread Starter
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Get off a ZX14 and hop on another scoot and almost all feel a tad "underpowered".

When in 4th gear at 150 and the tach says you still got a couple thousand rpm to before you need to shift -- well there is the story and an old coward bastard like me just clicks into 6th and rolls off the throttle

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post #36 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 02:43 PM
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stay off YOUR wifes 919, dickweed
or is she an ex now?





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post #37 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichT View Post
Sometimes I'm absolutely amazed at the attitudes about 919 power and handling in here.

While it doesn't have as much as a lot of the performance type bikes, It still has far more power and better handling than most riders I've seen can/will use.

Most guys I've seen riding (along with 3-4 919 riders) on skyline (hwy 35) don't even come close to its performance limits. And as for the guys that have the latest/greatest/most powerful sportbikes (with 2 inch chicken strips), they are effing hilarious.

Bottom line. The 919 has enough power to give a rush to 95% of the riders out there. While I think a lot of riders think they can take advantage of more power, they usually cant.
I'm a 95%'er

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post #38 of 39 Old 02-10-2012, 05:02 PM
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any twist of the throttle on any size bike is exhilarating to me....people get killed on 35 hp bikes and 190 hp bikes...how that exhilaration working

dont need a bike to ride the fast lane
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post #39 of 39 Old 02-11-2012, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
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Sometimes I'm absolutely amazed at the attitudes about 919 power and handling in here.

While it doesn't have as much as a lot of the performance type bikes, It still has far more power and better handling than most riders I've seen can/will use.

Most guys I've seen riding (along with 3-4 919 riders) on skyline (hwy 35) don't even come close to its performance limits. And as for the guys that have the latest/greatest/most powerful sportbikes (with 2 inch chicken strips), they are effing hilarious.

Bottom line. The 919 has enough power to give a rush to 95% of the riders out there. While I think a lot of riders think they can take advantage of more power, they usually cant.
Shoot, I'm afraid to launch a friggin' wheelie on my 919 (makes me a 95%er as well I guess)! That being said, I love this bike the same today (in my freezing cold garage) as the first day I layed eyes on her. I loved the 1970-90's era motorcycles which is why I liked the design of the 9'er, then add the fuel injection to the mix---> I enjoy this bike for what it is, LOTS of FUN!!

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