White film in oil - Wrist Twisters
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post #1 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 10:04 AM Thread Starter
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White film in oil

Hey, so very quickly, i just picked up a 2007 cb919 with 29000km on it. Its soo clean its crazy. I havnt gotten to take it for a run yet but im getting it ready with an oil change and basic maintenance workover. I just put new synthetic oil in and after warming it up i noticed a small layer of what looked like milk over top. It stuck to the oil glass when i was looking at it. In addition to that the back exhaust if puffing abit of white/clear smoke that im pretty sure was just condensation. I checked the coolant and its in fine condition, no oil in it. Any suggestion? Id like to be sure to have a well running bike for the season.

Thanks for any help!

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post #2 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 11:33 AM
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What did the oil look like that you took out of the bike?
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post #3 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 12:07 PM
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Condensation is built up when you start a cold bike. Unless you run the bike long enough to get the oil up to a high enough temperature to evaporate the water from the oil then you will get a film of moisture in the oil. This is why you should never do a quick start of your bike then shut it off without getting it up to proper operating temp.

If excessive moisture or Coolant is in the oil then it is generally a blown head gasket.
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post #4 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 01:06 PM
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One way to help discern whether it's a crankcase condensation problem or a coolant ingress problem is to keep the following in mind.

A white film on top is an oil/water and/or coolant emulsion and the reason it's on top after shutdown is because it has a lower density than oil.
So this alone will not tell the story, as one can't tell if the "water" component of the emulsion is pure H2O as a combustion byproduct, or coolant, or a blend of H2O and coolant - keeping in mind that the coolant is typically 50 % water in its own right.
Also, oil/water emulsions tend to be fairly stable, and crankcase condensation based emulsions particularly so.
In other words don't expect them to disappear on their own over time.
What will drive them off is high engine oil and casing temperatures, which you only get on hot days at full operating temperature of hours duration.
Again, LDH is spot on re saying don't start up unless you take it to full operating temp, especially a ice cold engine and oil on a cold day.

A collection of liquid at the bottom of the oil sump, after an extended shutdown period, almost invariably means that coolant has escaped from the cooling system and migrated into the sump area.
It collects there because it has a higher density than oil, and is non miscible with oil.
LDH is spot on that this is typically from a failed head gasket.
If one suspects coolant in the oil, let the engine sit for at least a day, better yet 2, then drain at least the first two quarts into some clear glass ware, even a mixing bowl from a kitchen mixer, then let it sit for a day.
Look very carefully at the bottom, if you see collected liquid below the oil, you know you have a serious issue soon to haunt you in a major way.
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post #5 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 02:22 PM Thread Starter
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wow ok these are really helpful. When i drained it before the oil change nothing showed, only when i ran it for about 5 minutes did i see something but than it seems to have gone away. It sucks i just put synthetic in it. Il take it for a quick spin tonight and see if that changes anything. Although im prepared to do a headgasket job im not looking foward to it if thats the case.

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post #6 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 03:48 PM
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Don't panic. 29,000 klicks on your bike is nothing. That's 17,400 miles as we statesiders see it. The bike is barely broken in according to the Hornet Pilots here.
Don't drain that synthetic, either. Just look for an increase in your oil level.

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post #7 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 03:51 PM
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Do these bikes ever blow head gaskets?

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post #8 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Islandboy View Post
Do these bikes ever blow head gaskets?
I don't remember a confirmed case.
I just did a quick search for "blown head gasket".
Found an eerily similar thread going back to 2012.
Will resurrect it momentarily......................

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post #9 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 10:19 PM Thread Starter
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right, i guess im just used to badly running bike, though i knew that when i was buying them. Also is it niormal for the temperature gage to drop to just above the cold mark when riding in 2 deg weather?

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post #10 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcromo44 View Post
One way to help discern whether it's a crankcase condensation problem or a coolant ingress problem is to keep the following in mind.

A white film on top is an oil/water and/or coolant emulsion and the reason it's on top after shutdown is because it has a lower density than oil.
Oil is less dense than water/coolant. Typo? That's why it settles to the bottom of the oil pan, like you said.


Also, my bike has the temp gauge sit just under the tick, just as you said, on cold days. That's just how it is.

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post #11 of 30 Old 03-30-2018, 11:00 PM
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When up to temp and moving my bikes temp is just above the gap in the temp gauge. Mostly regardless of outside temp.
Also I just had to take my bike for a two hour hard ride today. Just to burn of any condensation.....he he.

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post #12 of 30 Old 03-31-2018, 03:37 AM
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Have you ever had a buddy come to your house, and want you to start your bike for a few seconds, just to hear it run. I hate that. You make a habit of that, and pretty soon with FI bikes, and real soon with carbureted bikes, you'll be changing spark plugs. These bikes were made to be ran long and hard.

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post #13 of 30 Old 03-31-2018, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanktm View Post
Oil is less dense than water/coolant. Typo? That's why it settles to the bottom of the oil pan, like you said.


Also, my bike has the temp gauge sit just under the tick, just as you said, on cold days. That's just how it is.
The emulsion will be aerated, so will be the lightest and float above oil.
Yes, oil is less dense than water, so will float above any water or a water/coolant mix, once the fluids have been allowed adequate time to settle after the extreme churn of sump activity while running.

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post #14 of 30 Old 03-31-2018, 07:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolby Angiolella View Post
right, i guess im just used to badly running bike, though i knew that when i was buying them. Also is it niormal for the temperature gage to drop to just above the cold mark when riding in 2 deg weather?
Yes, you are seeing a normal gauge reading for the cold weather condition.
Also.
The oil temp will also be much lower on such days as compared to a hot summer day.
It's impossible to get anywhere approaching full oil temp on such days due to the cold air blast on the crankcase and sump, aluminum being such a good heat transfer material.

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post #15 of 30 Old 03-31-2018, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolby Angiolella View Post
right, i guess im just used to badly running bike, though i knew that when i was buying them. Also is it niormal for the temperature gage to drop to just above the cold mark when riding in 2 deg weather?

Are you serious here or just having fun?

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post #16 of 30 Old 03-31-2018, 09:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigdaa View Post
Are you serious here or just having fun?
Sorry dont know what you mean.

Ok so took the bike out for about 4 30min rides yesterday and today and the oil looks clear as can be. Woo!! Im still going to keep an eye on the oil level for abit though.
Thanks for the updates on the temp gauge, its good to know that thats the way its supposed to work. The only other bike ive owned with a thermostat gauge was a honda cx650e (had 5 before the 919). The thermostat on that would move up to about 3/4 and sit there all happy no matter the weather. Probably my favorite bike before the 919.

Just a few more small things. (1) theres a whine when riding, maybe just the normal sound of the gears meshing but ive always been curious what it was (2) There a slight knocking sound when im running, it doesn't usually go away after it warms up, is it possible there tenssioner is abit loose? if the valves tick 8 times a second you would head the know 2 times a second ( was that clear?). Il see if i can post a photo or two of the bike. Maybe see if i can capture the sound.

thanks again for all your help!

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post #17 of 30 Old 04-01-2018, 04:00 AM
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post #18 of 30 Old 04-01-2018, 05:39 AM
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Both noises are normal, you'll learn to enjoy them.

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post #19 of 30 Old 04-01-2018, 06:27 AM
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It whines, ticks and clunks.
Get some really loud pipes and all those little noises will go away!
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post #20 of 30 Old 04-01-2018, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
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It whines, ticks and clunks.
Get some really loud pipes and all those little noises will go away!
Truth!

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post #21 of 30 Old 04-01-2018, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
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haha yea i guess so. Alright well il keep an eye on everything and report back if anything seems funky. I love this bike already. While i have your attention, is there any mods you would suggest that would improve ride quality? Im big on suspension upgrades, i live in montreal and we regularly have to deal with potholes.

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post #22 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 01:26 AM
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An Ohlins shock for the back and, at least heavier springs in the forks. I went with springs and Ohlins valves in the forks, best $$ I've spent on the 919.

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post #23 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 03:00 AM
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For sure quality rear shock and fork springs is an excellent investment in your 919. Especially if you intend on keeping the bike for a while. Makes the bike more compliant and ride more comfortable. Get it setup for your weight and riding style. Good time to rebuild your forks, bushings, seals, oil etc.
Aftermarket exhaust and a pc111usb. Bike will sound and run better.
Aftermarket handlebars if you find the stock bars uncomfortable.
When time to replace chain and sprockets go for a 17t front sprocket and 44t rear. Helps to match up highway speed and revs.
Tail tidy to show off that fat tire.
Aftermarket led indicators.
Led headlight, cause the stock sux a bit.
Seat recover if you gets a little butt sore.
Stainless steel braided brakelines for more "bite".
Some cheap mods would be.
Pair valve removal. Really cleans up the head area under tank.
Flapper mod. It is shit.
Reverse your swing arm bolt. Makes for removing your chain intact for cleaning easy.
Keep an eye on your rear wheel bearing, They often wear quick.
Set your chain tensioner bolts on opposite lock to stop loss of tension under power.
Go the next level.
Turbo.
Rebuild your top end with fireblade bits. Mark61...Legend.
I almost forgot, a watch.

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post #24 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 04:09 AM
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Everything is OK, unless you see bubbles in the gage face.

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post #25 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 04:58 AM
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Damn bubbles. Also if the left footpeg gets buzzy at certain revs it's toast.

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post #26 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 07:11 AM Thread Starter
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Wow i didnt know there were so many options. Im going to look into the suspension upgrades for sure. What do you mean rebuild the top end with fireblade bits?

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post #27 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 10:30 AM
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A member here recently fitted a cbr900 cam to a 919. Very clever and involved.
Post a pic of your bike if ya get time and the inclination.

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post #28 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 07:36 PM
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Kolby there is also this. Helpful topics for 919 owners.
https://www.wristtwisters.com/f94/hel...l#/topics/1209

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post #29 of 30 Old 04-02-2018, 07:45 PM Thread Starter
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No way! Thats definitely something im going to do some research on. ive only got this one photo right now, waiting for some better weather to go out for photos. Just a side question, is it possible for tires to be really loud? i can hear them (i think its the tires) even when riding over 50. Could it be the bearing?

Thanks again!
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post #30 of 30 Old 04-03-2018, 10:21 PM
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Are your chain and sprockets the original OEM the bike came new with? The front sprocket can be a little noisy, especially if worn, not lubricated or chain adjustment is off.

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