Small engine surging - Wrist Twisters
 
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post #1 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 05:02 PM Thread Starter
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Small engine surging

Hey guys,

This is going to be kind hard to describe since I am deaf and can only go by feel and seeing the Tach. When "cold" ( if you call that in Tx) on first start up there is quite a noticeable surge while warming up, about 20-25 RPM's worth. It does smooth out when warmed up, but even at operating temp while sitting in traffic it still does it, but down to about just a small amount (maybe 10-15 rpm's). I can feel it quite a bit. I'm new to the 919 so don't know if they all do this or if I need to be checking something out.

It has after market pipes and PCIII (which I have not done anything too). I wish I could more descriptive, but I can only go on how it feels and I can definitely feel it. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Oh, just over 10k miles if that matters.

Thanks!

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post #2 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 05:23 PM
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Mine idles fine, i guess the needle does move a tad more when warming up, but hardly noticable.

You can feel the difference of 10-25 RPM difference even when it red lines at 9,500??


You're probably fine. 919 engines are damn near bulletproof....unless you mount sliders to them....................

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post #3 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrw69 View Post
Hey guys,

This is going to be kind hard to describe since I am deaf and can only go by feel and seeing the Tach. When "cold" ( if you call that in Tx) on first start up there is quite a noticeable surge while warming up, about 20-25 RPM's worth. It does smooth out when warmed up, but even at operating temp while sitting in traffic it still does it, but down to about just a small amount (maybe 10-15 rpm's). I can feel it quite a bit. I'm new to the 919 so don't know if they all do this or if I need to be checking something out.

It has after market pipes and PCIII (which I have not done anything too). I wish I could more descriptive, but I can only go on how it feels and I can definitely feel it. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Oh, just over 10k miles if that matters.

Thanks!
It's probably just the 919. It's got that naturally and seems to be amplified by after market pipes. If you want to compare it side by side with mine, PM me and I'll give you my address. (I'm near 1000 oaks and naco)

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post #4 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boogunoogun View Post
Mine idles fine, i guess the needle does move a tad more when warming up, but hardly noticable.

You can feel the difference of 10-25 RPM difference even when it red lines at 9,500??


You're probably fine. 919 engines are damn near bulletproof....unless you mount sliders to them....................
I'd put it closer to 50-100rpm difference. I certainly notice it.

if you love your motorcycle, set it free.. if it comes back and hits you.. you highsided
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post #5 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 07:32 PM
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Mine never settles to an absolute even and certain idle - there's always a bit of what my dear old Dad used to call "hunting". If I had to write it, it would be a series of interchangeable randomised lines of "ba-doom-boom-boom-boom-ba-doom-ba-doom-ba-doom-ba-doom-boom - boom-boom-ba doom".

It absolutely doesn't do it at higher revs, or under load, but it just isn't a sweet even idle. I've played around with the PCIII to try and change it - leaning it off got rid of the choke-on "blub-blub-blub"-type noise that used to be there.

It doesn't worry me, it's just there...

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post #6 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 08:19 PM
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technical term is called loping or an idle lope

it will always do it, mine does and has always done it more noticeably when its cold and it evens out when warm but never fully goes away. Just a characteristic of the bike.

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post #7 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 08:57 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input guys I appreciate it. I am glad to know it's just the characteristics of the 919 that makes me feel a lot better about it. K1, that's a hell of lot better description than I came up with! Speaking of the choke on "blub-blub-blub" that must be another thing I need to get used to. If I don't pull the "choke" out for the first start up, then it really is noticeable. I guess they are just very cold natured since we are in the mid 80's first thing in the morning and without pulling the choke out about a quarter inch it hunts around for an idle speed big time. Doesn't take long to settle down but I figured in this heat I would never need it. My FJR/R6 was steady as a rock even first thing. Thanks for letting me know it's all normal. Beefsalad I would love to hook up sometime.

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post #8 of 12 Old 08-27-2014, 09:17 PM
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You shouldn't need the choke where you are at, 'unless' you have a Power Commander installed. There is a known issue with some PC's that cause issues on cold startup (tons of threads on it), but the enrichener knob won't really help in that case.

I'm in Idaho and never used it.

We have another member here whose also deaf, maybe he can enlighten you on his 919 experience, but everything you've mentioned so far seems normal.

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post #9 of 12 Old 08-28-2014, 05:09 AM Thread Starter
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Have a lot to learn about this bike! So, how difficult is removing the power commander? Do I really need it, are gains substantial from stock? I'll admit, I've never had a bike with one since usually I am happy with how they come from the factory (talking about engine/fuel related things) and have never really been a fan of changing those types of things. There is lots of other things to do than messing with mapping. I do have aftermarket pipes, would the mapping adjust itself without the PC?

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post #10 of 12 Old 08-28-2014, 09:34 AM
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Power commander isn't hard to remove, but most people, even if you have the 'cold start' issue, leave it in there for the benefits.

It doesn't add any 'Power' necessarily, it just smooths out the throttle response and torque curves of power delivery.

The trick to overcoming the cold start issue is just keep the starter button thumbed down for a bit longer while started, even after it starts to fire up. Just keep holding it down for another 2-3 seconds, blipping the throttle while doing so.

And you can remove the PCIII and leave the aftermarket pipes, won't hurt anything, but it probably won't run as smooth.

We have a bunch of maps in our shared Dropbox folder, if you want to try running some different maps on your PC.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ra9j3gn4c...L4JuwuBKa?dl=0

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post #11 of 12 Old 08-28-2014, 02:08 PM Thread Starter
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What does holding down the start button accomplish? Is that every time I start up?

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post #12 of 12 Old 08-28-2014, 02:15 PM
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This is only if you experience the 'cold start' symptoms when starting your bike.

E.G. you thumb the starter, it fires up, you let go of the starter button, it dies. Repeat two or three times, etc.

At any ambient temperature above 60 degrees or so, the 919 (with a strong battery) should start and idle immediately without using the enrichener knob.

If you experience multiple failures on initial starting, it's 99% probably the PCIII. Removing it removes this problem.

The workaround is to hold the starter down longer while starting (even after it starts firing) and blipping the throttle as well.

Read more here:

https://www.wristtwisters.com/forums/...fix-31557.html

and here: https://www.wristtwisters.com/forums/...lty-36841.html

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
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