Shifting issue/engine noise - Wrist Twisters
 1Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 56 Old 04-24-2016, 02:06 PM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Shifting issue/engine noise

Been unsuccessful in trying to post this question up, third times a charm I hope.

Im dealing with some ringing, almost metallic rattling when I rev. It sounds like it coming from the clutch side of the engine. That would also jive with the missed shifts/false neutrals I experienced last ride (common complaint I've read, but I never used to experience it till now). I could have sworn that at some point I was also not getting all gears, or sometimes my shifter would get "lost" and not be in the gear I expected it to be in (if that makes sense).

Hoping to source some advice on where I can start to diagnose the problem. Worn clutch plates and springs maybe? or (gulp) worn shift forks? Oil/filter change last month, not tons of mileage though I did do a track day since then.

Chime in please if you have any advice. Thanks guys!

honda ng gingsa is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 56 Old 04-24-2016, 04:23 PM
Tesserarius
 
Stutz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Macon, ga
Posts: 717
Rep Power: 1
 
How many miles on the bike?
Is the clutch lever adjusted right?
What are you riding in - tennis shoes or boots? Shift lever might need to be lowered.
Stutz is offline  
post #3 of 56 Old 04-24-2016, 06:09 PM
Tesserarius
 
nathanktm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Floral Park
Posts: 619
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

The only noises I've had occur to my bike AND i've successfully dealt with include the CHAIN and BAD GAS. If it sounds kind of like a little piece of metal is banging around inside the cylinder, it might be pinging.

But to help you more, I'd need to know more. What RPM does it happen at? Under acceleration? Cold engine or warm? Free rev or in gear?

nathanktm is offline  
 
post #4 of 56 Old 04-24-2016, 06:24 PM
Tirone Choolaces
 
marylandmike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 11,123
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Donation Donation 
Total Awards: 3

Also check for a broken exhaust mount under the engine. Common issue that will give a metallic vibration/ rattle.

Clutch problems are pretty rare on these bikes and the shifting issue may just be not up-shifting forcefully enough.

marylandmike is offline  
post #5 of 56 Old 04-24-2016, 06:28 PM
Tesserarius
 
nathanktm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Floral Park
Posts: 619
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

I do remember reading somewhere that running thicker oil had helped with "false neutrals." Since going from 10w-30 to 10w-40, I either shift harder or it's helped. Can't be 100% though.

nathanktm is offline  
post #6 of 56 Old 04-25-2016, 07:28 AM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
badmoon692008's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Neenah, WI
Posts: 2,218
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Extraordinary Ride 
Total Awards: 1

+1 check chain and exhaust mount

Love is the feeling you get when you like something as much as your motorcycle - Hunter S. Thompson
I just mı̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̨ade you wipe your screen.
-2009 Suzuki GSX-R 750 Race Bike
-2007 Honda 919
-1995 Nighthawk 750 (Tboned)
-1983 KZ 440 (Sold)
badmoon692008 is offline  
post #7 of 56 Old 04-25-2016, 08:22 AM
Old, Bold rider
 
robtharalson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Aurora, Colorado
Posts: 2,354
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Veteran Community Leadership 
Total Awards: 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by honda ng gingsa View Post
That would also jive with the missed shifts/false neutrals I experienced last ride (common complaint I've read, but I never used to experience it till now). I could have sworn that at some point I was also not getting all gears, or sometimes my shifter would get "lost" and not be in the gear I expected it to be in
From that it sounds like the shift drum detent spring has broken, and with nothing to hold the drum in place it will stop anywhere it feels like instead of where it needs to be to maintain gear engagement. Fortunately it's easy to inspect by removing the clutch cover, and from the pictures in the service manual it may be possible to replace the spring without dismantling the clutch (not sure about that though). At least you won't have to remove the engine and split the cases!

Good luck!

Rob

If it has already been done, it is safe to assume it is possible to do it.
On the other hand, if it has not been done never assume it is impossible to do it.
------- Rob --------
robtharalson is offline  
post #8 of 56 Old 04-27-2016, 03:59 PM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Bingo! Broken exhaust mount. At least thats the ringing/rattling im hearing diagnosed.

Now onto the shifting thats playing up...

Thanks! Will keep you guys posted
Attached Images
File Type: jpg image_1461794278810.jpg (181.6 KB, 33 views)

honda ng gingsa is offline  
post #9 of 56 Old 04-27-2016, 07:25 PM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,638
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda ng gingsa View Post
Bingo! Broken exhaust mount. At least thats the ringing/rattling im hearing diagnosed.

Now onto the shifting thats playing up...

Thanks! Will keep you guys posted
How are you doing these days?
Haven't seen you posting in a while.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #10 of 56 Old 04-28-2016, 06:51 PM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcromo44 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda ng gingsa View Post
Bingo! Broken exhaust mount. At least thats the ringing/rattling im hearing diagnosed.

Now onto the shifting thats playing up...

Thanks! Will keep you guys posted
How are you doing these days?
Haven't seen you posting in a while.
Hey mcromo ? Been on and off the hornet. Built a cb550 vintage and was busy with that forever. All is good, just some niggly gremlins with the niner now after pushing it hard on a couple of trackdays. Hope to get it figured out soon.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg image_1461891008067.jpg (122.0 KB, 36 views)

honda ng gingsa is offline  
post #11 of 56 Old 04-29-2016, 06:12 AM
Fool in the Rain
 
HondaJim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Louisville, Kentucky
Posts: 10,284
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Extraordinary Ride Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 4

Never been to a trackday that allowed exposed glass. I've always had to tape, or preferably remove, everything.

"Towards the end of the vid, it looks like she may have had a bafflectomy." - MarylandMike
HondaJim is offline  
post #12 of 56 Old 04-29-2016, 08:01 AM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Ya, found that pretty odd too. This was a california superbike course at that. I went to the trouble of disconnecting the headlight but scruteneering didnt tape up any of our lights. Just the speedos and away we went.

honda ng gingsa is offline  
post #13 of 56 Old 04-29-2016, 08:16 AM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,638
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda ng gingsa View Post
Hey mcromo ? Been on and off the hornet. Built a cb550 vintage and was busy with that forever. All is good, just some niggly gremlins with the niner now after pushing it hard on a couple of trackdays. Hope to get it figured out soon.
Is your CB550 a stock build or modified?
Any pics?

What kind of gremlins does the niner have or display?

mcromo44 is offline  
post #14 of 56 Old 04-29-2016, 07:20 PM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Mcromo,

I caught the whole vintage cafe bug that seems to be in vogue now. Haha.

Started with an absolute basket case of a 76 cb550 and got it up and running. Unfortunately its dry-docked again. Chasing a leak at the valve head.

Meanwhile on the 919, it seems i have a broken tab holding the header under the engine causing some rattling/ringing but it also hasnt been feeling good in the shifting department. Im trying to diagnose missed shifts and the shift lever sometimes feeling "lost" and unable to find the gear.
Attached Images
File Type: jpeg image_1461978911727.jpeg (138.4 KB, 25 views)
File Type: jpg image_1461979003865.jpg (205.8 KB, 29 views)

honda ng gingsa is offline  
post #15 of 56 Old 04-29-2016, 08:50 PM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,638
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda ng gingsa View Post
Mcromo,

I caught the whole vintage cafe bug that seems to be in vogue now. Haha.

Started with an absolute basket case of a 76 cb550 and got it up and running. Unfortunately its dry-docked again. Chasing a leak at the valve head.

Meanwhile on the 919, it seems i have a broken tab holding the header under the engine causing some rattling/ringing but it also hasnt been feeling good in the shifting department. Im trying to diagnose missed shifts and the shift lever sometimes feeling "lost" and unable to find the gear.
Nice pics !
Re the 550, valve head or cylinder head leak? If valve head, maybe lapping will cure the problem, but watch out for a sticky valve guide or too loose a valve guide.
Re the 919, note Tharlson's diagnostics above. If that is not the problem, and if you have had your shift linkage off for any reason, be sure that the centrelines of the lever arms are parallel. Maybe moving the lever arm on the transmission input shaft just one or two splines will solve the problem, that is IF your lever arm centrelines are not parallel (you will not find this in the manual !)

mcromo44 is offline  
post #16 of 56 Old 04-29-2016, 09:56 PM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcromo44 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda ng gingsa View Post
Mcromo,

I caught the whole vintage cafe bug that seems to be in vogue now. Haha.

Started with an absolute basket case of a 76 cb550 and got it up and running. Unfortunately its dry-docked again. Chasing a leak at the valve head.

Meanwhile on the 919, it seems i have a broken tab holding the header under the engine causing some rattling/ringing but it also hasnt been feeling good in the shifting department. Im trying to diagnose missed shifts and the shift lever sometimes feeling "lost" and unable to find the gear.
Nice pics !
Re the 550, valve head or cylinder head leak? If valve head, maybe lapping will cure the problem, but watch out for a sticky valve guide or too loose a valve guide.
Re the 919, note Tharlson's diagnostics above. If that is not the problem, and if you have had your shift linkage off for any reason, be sure that the centrelines of the lever arms are parallel. Maybe moving the lever arm on the transmission input shaft just one or two splines will solve the problem, that is IF your lever arm centrelines are not parallel (you will not find this in the manual !)
it seems to have developed the shift issue without me touching anything on the linkage that previoudly worked fine. I will add that i did have a parking lot whoopsie which probably led to the broken exhaust tab due to the givi crash bar putting pressure on it (its a shared mounting point under the engine) but that drop was on the brake side and not the shift side. It might really just be wear too. It doesnt happen every shift and 95% of the time i cant make it happen. Theres a bit of side to side slop at the shift lever thats developed over the years too, could be a factor too. Ill dissassemble the foot controls next chance i get and see if tyeres anything there.

honda ng gingsa is offline  
post #17 of 56 Old 04-30-2016, 02:03 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Interesting that this thread is here. I've been having transmission issues for a while now. I kept thinking it was the oil not holding up to the heat and breaking down prematurely. However, your description is pretty much exactly what I'm experiencing, but much worse and more often.

Thanks Rob for giving me a lead. I'll most likely pull the clutch cover this weekend and do a visual inspection. If the spring indeed is broken, I have 3 concerns: 1. could any pieces of metal done damage inside the transmission from the broken spring? 2. if I replace the spring with another OEM spring, will it break again at some point in the future? 3. Would the Evo shift star kit be worth trying out? The price is a bit steep - cbr900f, 919, Hornet Factory Pro 800 869-0497 EVO Shiift Star Kit

Pvster is offline  
post #18 of 56 Old 05-07-2016, 01:58 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Exclamation URGENT

Despite my uneasiness going this deep into the clutch/transmission, I went ahead and pulled the clutch cover off after draining the oil. I couldn't see anything with the clutch basket in, so I had to pull the clutch plates out. I'm now looking at the clutch center which is staked. while I was working out how to unstake the clutch center nut, I was surprised by how much freeplay I have between each gear. Is this normal?

For example, the bolt holes for the clutch springs will rotate 1 full bolt hole position on the clutch center. This cannot be right.... Can someone provide some feedback or insight on how much freeplay/rotation is supposed to be allowed on the clutch basket?

Pvster is offline  
post #19 of 56 Old 05-07-2016, 02:50 PM
Old, Bold rider
 
robtharalson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Aurora, Colorado
Posts: 2,354
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Veteran Community Leadership 
Total Awards: 3

The center basket drives the trans main shaft, and if it's in gear it will rotate back and forth enough to engage the shift dogs in both directions. If in neutral it should rotate relatively easily. From your description it sounds pretty much normal.

At this stage of disassembly it should be possible to see the detent arm and spring, though it may not be possible to access it for servicing.

Rob
Pvster likes this.

If it has already been done, it is safe to assume it is possible to do it.
On the other hand, if it has not been done never assume it is impossible to do it.
------- Rob --------
robtharalson is offline  
post #20 of 56 Old 05-07-2016, 03:00 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Thanks Rob.

Here is a video of the problem I'm having. You'll notice that the gearshift spindle is having a hard time changing gears sometimes. The lever gets caught up inbetween gears and will not reset until I rotate the clutch center/gears. Which gear it does it on varies, and I can't seem to replicate what's causing it. I can see the detent arm and spring, but can't tell if anything's broken or off.


Pvster is offline  
post #21 of 56 Old 05-07-2016, 06:29 PM Thread Starter
Cornicen
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Manila, Philippines
Posts: 516
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Hope that works out for you Pvster.

Upon checking whats hanging up on mine ive discovered its seems to be nothing more than my new boot! Went up half a size for extra comfort (oscar monty boots) and if im not concious, the extra width of the boot is catching the shift rod linkage when i shift up or down preventing a full shift. Simple problem. Mystery solved for me.

honda ng gingsa is offline  
post #22 of 56 Old 05-08-2016, 06:22 AM
Old, Bold rider
 
robtharalson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Aurora, Colorado
Posts: 2,354
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Veteran Community Leadership 
Total Awards: 3

From the video I'd say that is normal. For an explanation of the "problem" go here: https://www.wristtwisters.com/forums/...ml#post1181137 Post #8. Specifically the blocked illustration. If the engine is not driving the trans it may be possible to fully shift in either direction, but eventually the dogs will be in a blocked condition and will not engage unless the bike is rolled, or in this case the clutch inner basket is turned until the dogs come into the position where they are not blocked. From the video I can also say that the detent arm spring is not broken because when in a blocked condition and the inner basket is turned (first gear teeth are visible) the shift completes without having to move the shifter, meaning the detent roller is doing its job.

None of what I see indicates a problem with the selector mechanism.

Rob

If it has already been done, it is safe to assume it is possible to do it.
On the other hand, if it has not been done never assume it is impossible to do it.
------- Rob --------
robtharalson is offline  
post #23 of 56 Old 05-08-2016, 06:57 AM
Tesserarius
 
nathanktm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Floral Park
Posts: 619
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

looks totally fine to me

nathanktm is offline  
post #24 of 56 Old 05-08-2016, 09:53 AM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Thanks Rob, I remember that post so it was good to review.

I've gotten some particularly nasty shifts at speed at different times. Clutch cable is newer, lubed and well adjusted. I'll have to check the gear linkage as it's been a long time since I touched it.

I'm Starting to get concerned that either I have a transmission issue or a clutch issue. I'll need to pick up a digital caliper at harbor freight and measure the clutch springs as well as the clutch packs.

Pvster is offline  
post #25 of 56 Old 05-13-2016, 08:35 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Gah. Nearly dropped a clutch plate while trying to move stuff around. Luckily I caught it but managed to tear some of the clutch material. Is this still usable or am screwed?

Sorry camera sucks. Went all crazy on me.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg ForumRunner_20160513_193432.jpg (52.4 KB, 36 views)

Pvster is offline  
post #26 of 56 Old 05-13-2016, 08:41 PM
Tesserarius
 
nathanktm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Floral Park
Posts: 619
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

That is one awful picture. If it were my bike, I wouldn't be worried about it. Then again, I really can't see how bad it is. I'm sure it's totally fine.

nathanktm is offline  
post #27 of 56 Old 05-14-2016, 11:27 AM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Yeah, it's a really bad picture. If you look at the middle pack between the 2 notches/tabs, you'll see the clutch material is torn. Not sure if I can reuse it or if I'm screwed? Can anyone chime in? I got all my parts last night and I want to get this thing buttoned up so it can set overnight before I pour oil in it and ride it tomorrow.

Pvster is offline  
post #28 of 56 Old 05-14-2016, 12:06 PM
Princeps Prior
 
redline919's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 1,894
Rep Power: 1
 
Definitely can't be good for it. Seems you would have some chatter or the rest of the material would come off into your engine eventually. I would replace it.

redline919 is offline  
post #29 of 56 Old 05-14-2016, 12:15 PM
Princeps Prior
 
redline919's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 1,894
Rep Power: 1
 
Your local Honda dealer should have them on hand since they share the same part #s as many other bikes.

redline919 is offline  
post #30 of 56 Old 05-15-2016, 04:43 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
I agree, I decided to go ahead and replace the clutch plate. Sadly, no one around here has it in stock, which is stupid in my mind. Since I'll have to order online, I might as well get a digital caliper and make sure all of the clutch components are within spec before I order.

Meanwhile, I'm having a hell of a time getting the clutch basket back in. I'm able to use a screwdriver on the teeth in order to force the scissor gears to line up and allow me to get the clutch basket in. But I can't for the life of me get the nubs on the oil driven sprocket to line up with the clutch basket. This prevents me from getting the teeth on the clutch basket to sit flush with the scissor gears. I have maybe 1/16" sticking out. I've taken it off and back on multiple times while trying to eyeball and line up the nubs to no avail. I also use the manual's method of spinning the clutch basket while installing, to no avail.

I need help. How the hell do I get the backside of the clutch basket to line up with the nubs on the oil pump driven sprocket? It's making me crazy!

Pvster is offline  
post #31 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 11:15 AM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Anyone? I need a pro's help. I've taken out the basket and reinstalled at least 15 times now.

Pvster is offline  
post #32 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 11:58 AM
Optio
 
firedave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 953
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage
I'm not sure if it's the same on the 919 as I've never had the clutch out of it but on my ZX9R I had to put the drive gear on the clutch basket without the clutch basket bearing in place, then install the basket and then slide the bearing into place from the basket side. Not sure if you can do that or not from looking at the parts breakdown.

2016 Honda Africa Twin
2007 Honda 919
1998 Kawi ZX9R (Sold)
firedave is offline  
post #33 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 02:20 PM
Princeps Prior
 
redline919's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 1,894
Rep Power: 1
 
The manual says to rotate the oil pump chain while installing the clutch outer

redline919 is offline  
post #34 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 02:31 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by redline919 View Post
The manual says to rotate the oil pump chain while installing the clutch outer
Yeah I've tried that. It'll get hung up on the back side if the nubs don't line up perfectly. I've done this at least 15 times and it's aggravating.

Pvster is offline  
post #35 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 02:33 PM
Princeps Prior
 
redline919's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 1,894
Rep Power: 1
 
Do you think that maybe the nubs got bent? That's why it's so difficult to align?

redline919 is offline  
post #36 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 02:34 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by firedave View Post
I'm not sure if it's the same on the 919 as I've never had the clutch out of it but on my ZX9R I had to put the drive gear on the clutch basket without the clutch basket bearing in place, then install the basket and then slide the bearing into place from the basket side. Not sure if you can do that or not from looking at the parts breakdown.
You might be onto something here! I know you can slide the bearing on independently. Not sure if the scissor gears will allow me to keep the gears aligned without the bearing in place to keep pressure on the clutch basket drive gear. Thanks for the idea I'll look into it tonight.

Pvster is offline  
post #37 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 02:37 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by redline919 View Post
Do you think that maybe the nubs got bent? That's why it's so difficult to align?
Negative. The nubs are small, but seriously stout. It's just a matter of getting it perfectly lined up.

One other idea I have is to try and see if I can create enough space between the clutch basket and oil driven pulley in order to try and rotate the pulley without losing alignment of the scissor gears.

Pvster is offline  
post #38 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 02:58 PM
Old, Bold rider
 
robtharalson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Aurora, Colorado
Posts: 2,354
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Veteran Community Leadership 
Total Awards: 3

Come on now ... it's not that difficult! All you need to do is get the clutch outer installed to the point that it meets the oil pump / water pump drive sprocket, then rotate the drive chain until the drive pegs engage the holes in the clutch outer. Be sure the outer surfaces of the primary crankshaft gear and the clutch gear are flush with each other.

Easy peasy.

Rob

If it has already been done, it is safe to assume it is possible to do it.
On the other hand, if it has not been done never assume it is impossible to do it.
------- Rob --------
robtharalson is offline  
post #39 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 03:22 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,765
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by robtharalson View Post
Come on now ... it's not that difficult! All you need to do is get the clutch outer installed to the point that it meets the oil pump / water pump drive sprocket, then rotate the drive chain until the drive pegs engage the holes in the clutch outer. Be sure the outer surfaces of the primary crankshaft gear and the clutch gear are flush with each other.

Easy peasy.

Rob
Yeah that's what I thought Rob. But I know it's not the case because I've tried multiple times to rotate the oil pump pully as well as reinstalling the clutch basket while trying to line up the nubs. It just ain't happening. I'm going to try again tonight after taking a long break from it and see if I can create enough space between the pulley and the basket to rotate the pulley and feel for the nubs without losing scissor gear alignment.

Pvster is offline  
post #40 of 56 Old 05-16-2016, 06:30 PM
Old, Bold rider
 
robtharalson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Aurora, Colorado
Posts: 2,354
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Veteran Community Leadership 
Total Awards: 3

Unfortunately due to work time constraints I was not keeping up with this. The problem here is the sub gear is holding the clutch pinion too firmly to allow movement to engage the sprocket drive pins while rotating it. The only solution is to get the clutch hub as close to the sprocket as possible, then using a stiff wire simultaneously rotate the sprocket while pulling it toward the clutch to engage the holes, then pushing the clutch hub inward. Not easy to do with the sub gear loaded. Ideally, the pulser cover should be removed to access the alignment holes to unload the sub gear, then engaging the sprocket drive pins.

One too late question: how were you aligning the sub gear teeth to the primary gear teeth?

Rob

If it has already been done, it is safe to assume it is possible to do it.
On the other hand, if it has not been done never assume it is impossible to do it.
------- Rob --------
robtharalson is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wrist Twisters forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome