problems with downshifting when I stand still - Wrist Twisters
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 09:01 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Backlash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Norway
Posts: 51
Rep Power: 1
 
problems with downshifting when I stand still

After a quick search online, I found nothing special about the gearbox on the Hornet other than that they occasionally find a false neutral between the gears. What I experience and that bothers me is that if I have to stop and don`t get it down to 1 gear before I completely stop I must fight with the gears to get it down to 1. I have to release the clutch halfway or more out between each gear and it pops and bangs like crazy. The oil shall, according to the last owner been changed this year (and it looks good) Are they just like that or can something be done? Not a huge problem but annoying enough the few times I get into that situation on the road.
(Honda Hornet 900 2003 5500km)

Backlash is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 09:31 AM
Ian
 
HeliMech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Posts: 3,313
Rep Power: 1
 
Make sure the two bellcranks in the shift linkage are parallel. That can mess things up if they are off.

HeliMech is offline  
post #3 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 09:56 AM
Aquilifer
 
rpcraft's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,128
Rep Power: 1
 
It sounds counter intuitive, but don't try shifting with the bike at a dead stand still. It's just not really good on the shift forks. Rock or roll it forwards or backwards when you stop and are in an upper gear.

It also sounds like you may need to adjust your clutch (or perhaps replace it if it is worn).

If all else fails perhaps it's just a matter of getting more accustomed to shifting down while slowing and getting more acclimated with your clutch.

Rob C

88 Blue Hawk (NT650) Project Pics - http://tinyurl.com/clw8h3q
2000 DL650 - Being ridden but make me an offer if interested...
2002 DL1000 V-Strom
rpcraft is offline  
 
post #4 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 10:04 AM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
Yeah by nature of the style of the transmission in the motorcycle you have it has to be moving to shift. Just don't wait till your almost stopped to downshift.

Almost all motorcycles will not find it easy to shift if the rear tire isn't spinning

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #5 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 12:48 PM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Backlash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Norway
Posts: 51
Rep Power: 1
 
I know that motorcyclegearboxes arent silky soft and a firm movement while at speed is the best way to shift gears, but on my Suzuki Bandit 1997 as I now have run 0ver 70 000km with, I have not had this problem. Now it's not that I intentionally don`t change down when I slow down but occasionally there are other people in traffic that necessitates some rapid deceleration without much time to shift Then it would be nice to be able to shift down without a fight with the gears

Backlash is offline  
post #6 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 12:59 PM
Need money for parts.
 
ganktor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 629
Rep Power: 1
 
Mine has none of these problems. It does lurch a little if at a dead stop and going from neutral to first, but most bikes i have had experience with do that. Even my old 250R wheeler.
I did notice that when I first got my 919 that it had some weird shift traits, but a couple oil changes and some miles seem to have cured it. Or I just don't notice anymore.

ganktor is offline  
post #7 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 01:19 PM
Community Moderator
 
g00gl3it's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,614
Rep Power: 1
  

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

Honda's have 'clunkier' 1st-2nd gear transitions, period. I've yet to blow up a first or second gear on a Honda gearbox (or other part), just kick the sucker.

Oil changes do help, as does moving the shifter downwards slightly so you get a better, fuller grab on the shifter lever when you shift.

And yes, I said shifter like 50 times in that sentence, because if I didn't, we all know what MM would be saying...

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
2001 XR650R BRP (Big Red Pig)
2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
2007 Honda CB900F (sold)
2006 Honda VTX 1300C (sold)
YouTube Channel
g00gl3it is offline  
post #8 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 01:32 PM
Tirone Choolaces
 
marylandmike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 11,126
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Donation Donation 
Total Awards: 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by g00gl3it View Post
Honda's have 'clunkier' 1st-2nd gear transitions, period. I've yet to blow up a first or second gear on a Honda gearbox (or other part), just kick the sucker.

Oil changes do help, as does moving the shifter downwards slightly so you get a better, fuller grab on the shifter lever when you shift.

And yes, I said shifter like 50 times in that sentence, because if I didn't, we all know what MM would be saying...

marylandmike is offline  
post #9 of 25 Old 06-03-2013, 01:34 PM
Community Moderator
 
g00gl3it's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,614
Rep Power: 1
  

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by marylandmike View Post
Coward.


2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
2001 XR650R BRP (Big Red Pig)
2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
2007 Honda CB900F (sold)
2006 Honda VTX 1300C (sold)
YouTube Channel
g00gl3it is offline  
post #10 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 11:05 AM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
Shifty

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #11 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 12:40 PM
Former 919er
 
Ottawa919's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,872
Blog Entries: 9
Rep Power: 1
 
When you're out in the open road practicing your emergency braking, incorporate rapid, shifter taps. You can then use the quick left foot to tap down in any circumstance.

It's good defensive riding techinique anyway because it puts you in a favorable position to rocket out of there if another hazard is approaching. For example, you do an emergency stop due to a hazard in front and you notice a car approaching your six rapidly. Before you become sandwhich meet you can scoot out of harm, but only if you're in a gear that you can pull!

Ottawa919 is offline  
post #12 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 03:11 PM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
also helps i have found to at least do 6 down to 2 with clutch in... let clutch out just a smidge to get everything spun back up then down to 1.

Otherwise if you have more time 6 to 4, clutch out / let the clutch grab a bit, 4 to 2, clutch out / let the clutch grab a bit, 2 to 1.

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #13 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 03:44 PM
Di"zx"en
 
97af's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Northern Wisconsin
Posts: 718
Rep Power: 1
 
Of the 3 9'ners I've owned...When the chain gets slightly out of adjustment (loose), the downshifts get weird. Just for giggles, check your chain tension. Even if its just a little loose, work the adjusters a bit.

That'll work........
97af is offline  
post #14 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 04:18 PM
Man and Machine
 
Callinmeupward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Garden City
Posts: 729
Rep Power: 1
 
Id go back to what HeliMech said. Definetly true... I had put on a new shifter, had everything lined up wrong with the shift rod clamp bellcrank and the shifter linkage bellcrank.. it was always a pain in the ass to get it to drop into first until I got everything straight...

There's a thread with some exact info and pics on here. I have the worst luck with the search tool though so maybe someone will be extra kind and find it.

Callinmeupward is offline  
post #15 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 04:28 PM
Aquilifer
 
sytheii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,199
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpcraft View Post
It sounds counter intuitive, but don't try shifting with the bike at a dead stand still. It's just not really good on the shift forks. Rock or roll it forwards or backwards when you stop and are in an upper gear.

It also sounds like you may need to adjust your clutch (or perhaps replace it if it is worn).

If all else fails perhaps it's just a matter of getting more accustomed to shifting down while slowing and getting more acclimated with your clutch.
When I experience the issue you mention rolling forward or back and then going to 1st solves it. It has happened a couple of times. Embarrassing when you've split lanes till the front of the line, and can't launch when it goes green.

sytheii is offline  
post #16 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 05:51 PM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
The Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Boulder, Colorado
Posts: 2,762
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Veteran Extraordinary Ride Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

The solution is super-simple...downshift so that you find yourself in first gear prior to stopping.

Well, fire the engines! Spur this iron space-pony on!

"The Shadow"
The Shadow is offline  
post #17 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 06:04 PM
Aquilifer
 
sytheii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,199
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Shadow View Post
The solution is super-simple...downshift so that you find yourself in first gear prior to stopping.
Sometimes peeps like to chill at a green light and let it sit in neutral. I have never had an issue down shifting from any gear to neutral or first while moving slightly, but the problem he mentions does seem to happen when I go from second to neutral with a mini tap, then stop and relax at light, then when needing to go to first from there I get issues.

sytheii is offline  
post #18 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 06:34 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
Check the bells to be parallel like Heli says, shift like the bike owes you money like Goog says, and try to stay in the correct gear with the rapid taps. THey're easier to practice if you don't come to a dead stop at first. The incorporate putting a foot down for stopping.

Not to make it an oil thread but consensus shows the Honda red cap oil (GN-4 I think?) and Shell Rotella T6 5w-40/Triple Protection 15-40 have had great results with shifting. Maybe the super silky synthetic you're using could be a culprit, just to throw more things to ponder.

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #19 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 07:06 PM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
The Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Boulder, Colorado
Posts: 2,762
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Veteran Extraordinary Ride Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by sytheii View Post
Sometimes peeps like to chill at a green light and let it sit in neutral. I have never had an issue down shifting from any gear to neutral or first while moving slightly, but the problem he mentions does seem to happen when I go from second to neutral with a mini tap, then stop and relax at light, then when needing to go to first from there I get issues.
Sorry if i came across all grumpy... sometimes its hard to get neutral from 2nd. 2nd to 1st then to neutral generally always works, and neutral to 1st should always work.
Dammit, I AM all grumpy...Ill just shut up now, lol.

Well, fire the engines! Spur this iron space-pony on!

"The Shadow"
The Shadow is offline  
post #20 of 25 Old 06-04-2013, 10:29 PM
Aquilifer
 
sytheii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,199
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Shadow View Post

Sorry if i came across all grumpy... sometimes its hard to get neutral from 2nd. 2nd to 1st then to neutral generally always works, and neutral to 1st should always work.
Dammit, I AM all grumpy...Ill just shut up now, lol.
Hahah no worries mate, just speaking me mind, btw I interpreted no surliness. You know what always happens to me, and its prolly just poor form, but I get a "false neutral" I think its called? When coming from 1st to 2nd I just go to n, and sometimes that shit is scary, mostly happens when I'm tired, but I did it once turning and it wasn't pretty.

sytheii is offline  
post #21 of 25 Old 06-05-2013, 01:21 PM
Community Moderator
 
g00gl3it's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,614
Rep Power: 1
  

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by sytheii View Post
Hahah no worries mate, just speaking me mind, btw I interpreted no surliness. You know what always happens to me, and its prolly just poor form, but I get a "false neutral" I think its called? When coming from 1st to 2nd I just go to n, and sometimes that shit is scary, mostly happens when I'm tired, but I did it once turning and it wasn't pretty.
Did you ever try moving your lever downward a bit? That fixes 90% of those, because the lower lever forces your foot to travel farther to get back to a relaxed position, hence more pressure/travel on the lever. No missed shifts; or very little.

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
2001 XR650R BRP (Big Red Pig)
2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
2007 Honda CB900F (sold)
2006 Honda VTX 1300C (sold)
YouTube Channel
g00gl3it is offline  
post #22 of 25 Old 06-08-2013, 07:37 PM
Discen
 
VonDonnern's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 200
Rep Power: 1
 
Ive found some false neutrals....has anyone else tried 2nd gear starts on the 919. Could be me, but it doesnt seem to like them.

VonDonnern is offline  
post #23 of 25 Old 06-08-2013, 07:39 PM
Aquilifer
 
rpcraft's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,128
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VonDonnern View Post
Ive found some false neutrals....has anyone else tried 2nd gear starts on the 919. Could be me, but it doesnt seem to like them.

It's because of the clunky FI at idle and low throttle but I usually am in take off mode so starting in second gear is just something I really don't consider.

Rob C

88 Blue Hawk (NT650) Project Pics - http://tinyurl.com/clw8h3q
2000 DL650 - Being ridden but make me an offer if interested...
2002 DL1000 V-Strom
rpcraft is offline  
post #24 of 25 Old 06-08-2013, 08:15 PM
`
 
zaq123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: here n' there
Posts: 3,842
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 17

Quote:
Originally Posted by nd4spdbh View Post
Yeah by nature of the style of the transmission in the motorcycle you have it has to be moving to shift. Just don't wait till your almost stopped to downshift.

Almost all motorcycles will not find it easy to shift if the rear tire isn't spinning
What he said. Your ride the bike just like you drive stick shift, your bike/car always needs to be in the gear appropriate for speed. Slowing down, downshift so you are in first by time you get to the stop. Don't stop at 4th and then look for that first to take off, wrong.

zaq123 is offline  
post #25 of 25 Old 06-09-2013, 11:07 AM
Tirone
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 44
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VonDonnern View Post
has anyone else tried 2nd gear starts on the 919. Could be me, but it doesnt seem to like them.
Regularly at the PLP. I cannot be bothered to downshift into 1st at standstill at the end of an emergency stop, so I resume the ride in 2nd. Just a matter of practice.

JanK is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wrist Twisters forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome