Niner died tonight - Wrist Twisters
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 04:47 PM Thread Starter
Discen
 
deandeib's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Boothwyn
Posts: 298
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

Thumbs up Niner died tonight

Coming home from work tonight, my '07 niner (14.9k mi) died abruptly at an intersection. Engine cranks like hell but no attempt to start except for a brief moment right after I tried to fire it back up. Gas and oil levels are good and bike's been running like a top until tonight. Any suggestions on where to start looking for problems? Fuel pump sounds normal when key is turned on. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks guys.

deandeib is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 04:50 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
Battery? Battery cables? Maybe the ground cable underneath the gas tank to the frame?

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #3 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 04:56 PM
rmb
Let's go!
 
rmb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sussex Couty NJ
Posts: 7,655
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 9

Any codes being thrown by the indicator lights? And +1 to connections, double check the battery connections and the ground lug under the tank. Are the lights turning on as normal?

rmb is offline  
 
post #4 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 05:07 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,770
Rep Power: 1
 
Check your kill switch. Make sure it's working properly as well.

Pvster is offline  
post #5 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 05:12 PM
rmb
Let's go!
 
rmb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sussex Couty NJ
Posts: 7,655
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 9

I don't think it will crank if the kill switch is off...?

Edit: Nope, just tried it.

rmb is offline  
post #6 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 05:15 PM
Burn-em Upus Asphaltus
 
rickard919's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Calgary, Canada
Posts: 3,802
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Donation 
Total Awards: 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmb View Post
I don't think it will crank if the kill switch is off...?
Nope. The only time one of my niner's cranked without starting, it was bad plugs. Ran perfectly fine one day, wouldn't start the next. That's all I got. Do you have a power commander installed?

Spoiler:

rickard919 is offline  
post #7 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 05:36 PM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
Order of operations i would do on this.

Check fuses, Check battery cables, Check main ground under tank, check connectors at ECU, Check FPR.

Its going to be something simple... 9ers dont just up and die.

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #8 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 05:41 PM
rmb
Let's go!
 
rmb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sussex Couty NJ
Posts: 7,655
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 9

Quote:
Originally Posted by nd4spdbh View Post
Order of operations i would do on this.

Check fuses, Check battery cables, Check main ground under tank, check connectors at ECU, Check FPR.

Its going to be something simple... 9ers dont just up and die.
+1! To add the Powercommander taps, ground andTPS, (if applicable)

rmb is offline  
post #9 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 05:52 PM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
Yeah forgot to mention... if you have a power commander and it has caused an issue like this... take it off and sell it for that very reason....

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #10 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 06:12 PM
Old, Bold rider
 
robtharalson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Aurora, Colorado
Posts: 2,378
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Donation Veteran Community Leadership 
Total Awards: 3

Since most of the other probables posted would prevent the fuel pump from running (I.E. a blown ECU fuse or kill switch malfunction) which is not the case, It certainly sounds like the PCIII took a dump. Frankly, I'd follow suit and dump it.

Of course I'd check the connections to it first, but since you have previously posted on the PC cold start problem it seems to be a logical first place to look.

Rob

If it has already been done, it is safe to assume it is possible to do it.
On the other hand, if it has not been done never assume it is impossible to do it.
------- Rob --------
robtharalson is offline  
post #11 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 06:19 PM Thread Starter
Discen
 
deandeib's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Boothwyn
Posts: 298
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

Thumbs up

First of all, thanks to all you guys who responded with ideas so immediately.
In my going down the list of all the suggestions, I found a single light gauge ground wire from the PC to the neg batt terminal had broken off!
son-of-a-bitch! And that damn thing cost me $140 for the tow home but glad it's fixed. Could've been worse though. Could've been out on 95 middle of the night in a downpour. Actually, $160. I give the kid who was driving the flatbed an extra $40 for his NRA membership. He was open carry when he came to pick me up but said he couldn't quite swing the membership dues - now he can.

So, hearty thanks to rmb, nd4spdbh, Rickard919, Pvster, andrewbay1 and any other of the brothers who may be replying even as I write this. Glad to be a part of a great bunch of guys.

Merry Christmas!

deandeib is offline  
post #12 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 06:21 PM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
.... another PC3 causing a 919 issues..... another case on my list of "why i will never buy one"


Glad you found the issue... make sure you get a proper wire thats not gonna break off and leave you stranded haha.

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #13 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 07:45 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,770
Rep Power: 1
 
dur, was thinking of wrong thread when I posted in this one. You guys are right. Sorry about that.

glad you figured it out dean!

ndsp, you JUST bought an Ohlins, FINALLY! We're workin you over. Slowly but surely. we'll have a pool going to see what you'll send your money on next. I bet it'll be the PC3 since you were so vocal about not getting an Ohlins. Look where that got you

Pvster is offline  
post #14 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 08:03 PM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pvster View Post
dur, was thinking of wrong thread when I posted in this one. You guys are right. Sorry about that.

glad you figured it out dean!

ndsp, you JUST bought an Ohlins, FINALLY! We're workin you over. Slowly but surely. we'll have a pool going to see what you'll send your money on next. I bet it'll be the PC3 since you were so vocal about not getting an Ohlins. Look where that got you
But see, i never said the ohlins was a bad purchase, just and expensive one... the pc3 yeilds not a whole lot of benefits... and with all the issues the pc3 causes (cold start, random problems, and like above flat out bike dieing) i wont be getting one.

The ohlins only makes the bike better, and wont leave me stranded. hehe

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #15 of 27 Old 12-02-2013, 08:06 PM
The Cripple
 
Pvster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 8,770
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nd4spdbh View Post
But see, i never said the ohlins was a bad purchase, just and expensive one... the pc3 yeilds not a whole lot of benefits... and with all the issues the pc3 causes (cold start, random problems, and like above flat out bike dieing) i wont be getting one.

The ohlins only makes the bike better, and wont leave me stranded. hehe
Be careful, or that band aid on your tank will fall off and leave you stranded

Pvster is offline  
post #16 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 12:00 AM
Centurion
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,310
Rep Power: 1
 
Are PCIIIs that bad or is it how they are fitted that is the problem?

NZspokes is offline  
post #17 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 01:30 AM
rmb
Let's go!
 
rmb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sussex Couty NJ
Posts: 7,655
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 9

Glad you found the problem quickly Dean!

rmb is offline  
post #18 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 01:37 AM
Why's everything on fire?
 
CB700S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Dallas
Posts: 2,315
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by NZspokes View Post
Are PCIIIs that bad or is it how they are fitted that is the problem?
Both. They seem to have wiring harnesses that aren't terribly robust and the QC doesn't seem to be very good. The factory recommended install procedure uses methods that all but guarantee future failure. Plenty of threads here about that.

1986 Honda Nighthawk 700S
2002 Honda 919
CB700S is online now  
post #19 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 01:40 AM
Centurion
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,310
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CB700S View Post
Both. They seem to have wiring harnesses that aren't terribly robust and the QC doesn't seem to be very good. The factory recommended install procedure uses methods that all but guarantee future failure. Plenty of threads here about that.
So best to solder connections on them?

Ive been thinking about getting one.

NZspokes is offline  
post #20 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 02:33 AM Thread Starter
Discen
 
deandeib's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Boothwyn
Posts: 298
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

Been riding the niner almost three years with no issues until last night. PO had the PC already installed. Even with the ground wire detached, it still "looked" OK when I turned on the key, i.e., I saw the usual quick little light show on the column of LED's so I thought it was working. I was pretty sure it was a fuel problem and had good spark too so I was puzzled as to why no error codes Thanks again guys for all the help.

Dean

deandeib is offline  
post #21 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 02:33 AM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
The Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Boulder, Colorado
Posts: 2,762
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Veteran Extraordinary Ride Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

The electronics in them seem to be just so-so and fail semi frequently. Thewire connection that attaches to the TPS sensor wire can be problematic, the ground wire can cause problems... after my PC3 took a shit I decided my bike was better off with less than perfect fueling. It wasnt worth it.

Well, fire the engines! Spur this iron space-pony on!

"The Shadow"
The Shadow is offline  
post #22 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 02:36 AM Thread Starter
Discen
 
deandeib's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Boothwyn
Posts: 298
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 6

I always wondered how it would run without the PC3. Is there an easy way to switch it out temporarily just as a test?

deandeib is offline  
post #23 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 07:12 AM
Le So Cal Troll
 
nd4spdbh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: So Cal
Posts: 5,766
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by deandeib View Post
I always wondered how it would run without the PC3. Is there an easy way to switch it out temporarily just as a test?
simply unplug the pc3 from the piggy back harness off the main ecu if im not mistaken

nd4spdbh is offline  
post #24 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 09:31 AM
LDH
Test Rider
 
LDH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: by the ocean
Posts: 4,417
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Trackday Recognition Referral Award 
Total Awards: 2

You guys crack me up. I've sold thousands upon thousands of Powercommanders over the years. Do you know how many I've actually seen fail since the PCIII USB came out let alone the PCV? About 8...

Generally if there is a problem reported with a Powercommander it is due to an installation error like connecting the wrong electrical fitting (see this a lot with Kawi's) or tapping into the wrong TPS wire etc, but the newer units are becoming less & less reliant on wire taps anyway as they move towards plug & play OEM fittings. A little common sense with the installation can go a long way. If you leave the battery post connector exposed, hanging over the edge of your battery under your seat then eventually it will probably break off and kill the electrical connection. If you have hacked your undertail into pieces and the Powercommander has a habit of falling through the tail section of your bike and gets chewed up by the rear tire then that may also cause a failure Yes that actually happened...


I've also more than once seen some idiot not wanting to spend the money for a unit made specifically for his model bike so he cuts up the harness on an existing Powercommander and tries to wire it in to his new bike. That is a guaranteed recipe for failure and when it does fail he is the first guy on the forum screaming the Powercommanders are crap...

I have Powercommanders personally installed on every Fi bike I own or have owned for over 13 years now and I have never had one single failure.

LDH is offline  
post #25 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 09:57 AM
Centurion
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,310
Rep Power: 1
 
LDH, I guess they help with gas milage? is the best place to mount one in a 919 where they state in the manual? To me it looks a little exposed there.

NZspokes is offline  
post #26 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 10:13 AM
Community Moderator
 
g00gl3it's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,616
Rep Power: 1
  

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by NZspokes View Post
LDH, I guess they help with gas milage? is the best place to mount one in a 919 where they state in the manual? To me it looks a little exposed there.
There's lots of room in the tail section under the seat.

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
2001 XR650R BRP (Big Red Pig)
2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
2007 Honda CB900F (sold)
2006 Honda VTX 1300C (sold)
YouTube Channel
g00gl3it is offline  
post #27 of 27 Old 12-03-2013, 10:44 AM
LDH
Test Rider
 
LDH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: by the ocean
Posts: 4,417
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Trackday Recognition Referral Award 
Total Awards: 2

Remove the worthless OEM tool pouch & put the Powercommander in that slot.

My fuel mileage got worse after installing the Powercommander. The reason being is that my custom map felt so good to my wrist that I started playing up a lot more on the bike. When you get that increased and linear power delivery in your hands it is really hard to ride with restraint.

LDH is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wrist Twisters forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome