GAS leaking out of pipes (FPR/INJ) - Wrist Twisters
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post #1 of 17 Old 10-01-2017, 05:52 PM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
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GAS leaking out of pipes (FPR/INJ)

Hey Guys,
So Ive been workin' on my down bike and reading up on threads for the past week, And I could use some help. Ill keep it short and simple.

- 2002 Honda 919 (east coast owned ) now in AZ.
- 20320 miles on it
-----------------------------------------
- Sat for 5 years (read my introduction before posting ignorant comments). 2 years with gas in tank.
- Getting back on my feet - handed it over to a mechanic for a basic lube n check.
- Got it back - rode it for about 20-30 minutes around town / out around the farms. (60mph 3rd 4th gear highest).
- Get home: its pissing black fluid out from the bottom of exhaust connection to muffler pipe. And blowing gas out
of the muffler.
Its gas + carbon build up (not oil).
- Do some reading in our threads here on WT: find a commonality of 3 other 919 owners whos bike sat 2+yrs and had
the same problem of gas leaking out bottom of exhast pipe - conclusion is a bad FPR.
- Hand it back to mechanic: soaks the FPR in cleaner / gives it back to me / still leaking & now wont stay running n
stalls out.
- New discovery: Pipes 2&3 are cold after fire up. 1&4 are hot. Still pissing out gas immediately upon start up.
- I'm lifting the tank: changing the plugs out to new / and testing for spark.
- I get spark on all 4, but when testing 2&3, gas blasts out of the open hole.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, I originally thought: Bad fuel pump regulator / bad coil / bad plugs / or stuck open fuel injectors.
- I'm changing out all plugs regardless
- I got spark on all 4, so coils must be good. (?)
- Next step, swap out FPR. (I'm assuming this is the problem).

So my questions are:
- Would a bad FPR only dump out gas in 2&3, but not 1&4 ?
- Can injectors 3&4 be stuck open from sitting gas over the years - then why not all injectors.

Any help would be much appreciated

Stay healthy guys,

And thanks for taking the time to read.

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post #2 of 17 Old 10-01-2017, 06:08 PM
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It's a failed FPR. Washing in cleaner won't fix it because a internal diaphragm has developed a hole. Since the FPR works of the vacuum from cylinders 2 and 3. The FPR has vacuum hoses which run to cylinders 2 and 3 (throttle bodies). When the FPR fails it dumps fuel into cylinders 2 and 3. That is causing all your problems, 2 and 3 running cold, fuel pouring out etc. You can check this by removing one of these vacuum hoses. There should be no fuel present if the FPR is good. It's a fairly cheap part.
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post #3 of 17 Old 10-01-2017, 06:46 PM Thread Starter
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Very informative Islandboy. Right to the point.
Much appreciated - and thank you!

Im ordering a FPR tomorrow asap!

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post #4 of 17 Old 10-01-2017, 07:40 PM
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No sweat. Hope my advice helps. Post an update so we all know if it was a failed FPR.

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post #5 of 17 Old 10-01-2017, 08:17 PM
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I should also mention. When your new FPR arrives it should have a rubber bung jammed in its underside. Remove this bung before install. See pic.
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post #6 of 17 Old 10-12-2017, 04:59 PM Thread Starter
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Update:

FPR swap out for new(5 min), problem solved.
Also changed out plugs for new.
Bike is faster than ever.

Also - removed exhaust system to clean out. there was about a half pint of gas in the pipes. wow.
I noticed looking into the exhaust ports- that they were very black w/ carbon. (dont know if this is normal).

Only problem I have now is a serious hiccup in 1st gear low rpm. It coughs it way up to about 3000rpm and then bucks out of it. Ive been looking this up - but cant find a thread. So far Ive read MAPIII or FI. ?? IDK. This problem existed for quite some time back - so its not new.
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post #7 of 17 Old 10-12-2017, 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bis Sun View Post
Update:

FPR swap out for new(5 min), problem solved.
Also changed out plugs for new.
Bike is faster than ever.

Also - removed exhaust system to clean out. there was about a half pint of gas in the pipes. wow.
I noticed looking into the exhaust ports- that they were very black w/ carbon. (dont know if this is normal).

Only problem I have now is a serious hiccup in 1st gear low rpm. It coughs it way up to about 3000rpm and then bucks out of it. Ive been looking this up - but cant find a thread. So far Ive read MAPIII or FI. ?? IDK. This problem existed for quite some time back - so its not new.
Do you have a stock EFI or the PCIII after market system? Isn't MAPIII related to PCIII?

Either way, it sounds like your system is clogged up. I'd clean out any filters on the injectors and run some solvent thru the system.

The exhaust being clogged up could be a problem, you say it's an East coast bike, so you have no Cat? I don't know if a muffler could clog up so much that it can do that.

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post #8 of 17 Old 10-12-2017, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bis Sun View Post
Update:

FPR swap out for new(5 min), problem solved.
Also changed out plugs for new.
Bike is faster than ever.

Also - removed exhaust system to clean out. there was about a half pint of gas in the pipes. wow.
I noticed looking into the exhaust ports- that they were very black w/ carbon. (dont know if this is normal).

Only problem I have now is a serious hiccup in 1st gear low rpm. It coughs it way up to about 3000rpm and then bucks out of it. Ive been looking this up - but cant find a thread. So far Ive read MAPIII or FI. ?? IDK. This problem existed for quite some time back - so its not new.


What do you mean by having read MAPIII or FI?

Past that, on the basis of assuming that the ignition aspect is OK, I'm wondering if contaminated and sticky injectors are involved. (based on the history you gave)
But I would also check the MAP sensor hoses and connection in particular, just in case that is also involved.

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post #9 of 17 Old 10-13-2017, 07:02 PM
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Not sure what you mean Map 111 or FI?
Your bike has sat for years and you ran it with a failed FPR. I'm not supriseed it runs poorly at low revs. That failed FPR has dumped a lot of fuel in places it not meant to be. Check your airbox and related sensors, ie map and air intake sensors for fuel residue. Check your engine oil for fuel, washdown. Go right through your fuel delivery system. In your tank are strainers and a filter. Check your fuel rail for deposits. Check your injectors. Each injector has a filter basket in its inlet side. Condensation forms in fuel tanks sitting for long periods and the water will settle out in low spots. Check your fuel return system. Check all vacuum hoses for leaks. Might be worthwhile carrying out a starter valve synchronization.
Are you using a stock OEM air cleaner?
If you don't already have one get a power commander 111. It will allow you to sort out fueling issues.
Good luck.
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post #10 of 17 Old 10-22-2017, 06:45 PM Thread Starter
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Ok. The bike is half disassembled. I am going to proceed to check everything to the best of my knowledge within the next week or so. Starting with the fuel delivery system, I plan on taking the fuel injectors for a cleaning. 15 years old and gas sat in this bike for longer than I wanted it to.

So...... for the love of god.... how in the he'll does the fuel rail come off????? Brass bolts have no clearance what so ever - not to mention the one in the middle. Where these fuel injectors designed to ever be serviced???? Do I have to disassemble half the bike just to get them out?
?????
Any help would be much appreciated. Thank you.

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post #11 of 17 Old 10-22-2017, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bis Sun View Post
Ok. The bike is half disassembled. I am going to proceed to check everything to the best of my knowledge within the next week or so. Starting with the fuel delivery system, I plan on taking the fuel injectors for a cleaning. 15 years old and gas sat in this bike for longer than I wanted it to.

So...... for the love of god.... how in the he'll does the fuel rail come off????? Brass bolts have no clearance what so ever - not to mention the one in the middle. Where these fuel injectors designed to ever be serviced???? Do I have to disassemble half the bike just to get them out?
?????
Any help would be much appreciated. Thank you.
Can you post some pics or make a good video of what you're dealing with? Did you look at the manual?

Here's a photo, looks like it's just a few bolts. The seals might be stuck. Might be best to shoot it with some WD-40 or some other lube. See if you can get the injectors to twist around.

https://www.bikebandit.com/oem-parts...?a=1#sch415606

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post #12 of 17 Old 10-22-2017, 07:48 PM
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When I cleaned out my fuel rail, injectors etc I removed the entire airbox, throttle bodies still attached to it. Then I removed the throttle bodies, then the fuel rail etc. The whole airbox/throttle body assembly comes out fairly easy. There are some posts on this site about it. Good opportunity to clean places you can't normally get at. Have fun.

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post #13 of 17 Old 10-22-2017, 07:59 PM
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+1 to what island said. It's actually fairly easy to take off the fuel rail once you get to it. If you haven't yet, check out the Honda service manual. Outta has a great walkthrough.

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post #14 of 17 Old 10-23-2017, 03:56 PM Thread Starter
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Throttle body removal: all associated fasteners and sensors removed and unplugged. Throttle cables dismounted at handlebars. All hose clamps loosened. Cannot get the throttle body to pull off the hoses for the life of me! It just will not budge. I've tried wedging them off with just about everything I have.????????

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post #15 of 17 Old 10-23-2017, 04:03 PM
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Sent you a PM. Lever them off gently, working one at a time 1 to 4 with a pry bar. Airbox comes out left side.
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post #16 of 17 Old 10-23-2017, 07:48 PM
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After dumping that much fuel into your engine it would be a good idea to change the oil maybe twice

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post #17 of 17 Old 10-24-2017, 01:25 PM
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+1 to what SPYDER said. Check/change engine oil because of potential fuel washdown.
My bike had sat for ten years with no fuel in it. Condesation and rust had got into everything. The old fuel filter I cut open. It looked as if it was full of mud! Bike still ran but a little rough. I stripped out the entire fuel system. Cleaned and replaced everthing with new or good second hand parts. New pump, filter and FPR. Second hand fuel lines and fuel rail. I replaced the fuel tank and the pump mount. New vacuum hoses. I cleaned the injectors and throttle body. When bike was all back together I carried out a starter valve synchronization. This really smoothed out the idle and low revs.

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