919 Frame Integrity Question - Wrist Twisters
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 07:15 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: town
Posts: 22
Rep Power: 1
 
919 Frame Integrity Question

I acquired a 919 and have discovered that the cross beam for the front engine mounts is more than half destroyed by rust.
Enclosed pic from the frame diagram.



Is the frame gone at this point?

Thanks.

Junker is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 09:01 AM
TEXAN
 
MF1VE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Midland, TX
Posts: 1,524
Rep Power: 1
 
It does make me wonder what else is rusted. If it's only the tube, and it was my bike, I'd weld in a new tube.

MF1VE is offline  
post #3 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 09:14 AM
Burn-em Upus Asphaltus
 
rickard919's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Calgary, Canada
Posts: 3,802
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Donation 
Total Awards: 1

Lets see a picture of it. I have an '02 that's rusty but not rusted thru yet.

Spoiler:

rickard919 is offline  
 
post #4 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 09:36 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: town
Posts: 22
Rep Power: 1
 
Here is the shape the cross bar is in.

Side left view:



From below:



Front view:



Front 2:



It's pretty bad...

Junker is offline  
post #5 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 09:44 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: town
Posts: 22
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MF1VE View Post
It does make me wonder what else is rusted. If it's only the tube, and it was my bike, I'd weld in a new tube.
I was wondering how bad the remaining unseen areas are as well.

If the frame is boned, the bike is done.
The cost and hassle of a frame replacement is more than the bike is worth.

Junker is offline  
post #6 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 04:58 PM
LackOfCharismaCanBeFatal
 
vukmang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: los angeles
Posts: 85
Rep Power: 1
 
give it back to the insurance company,,,let them figure out what to do with it,,,,my sincere advice.

lack of charisma can be fatal
vukmang is offline  
post #7 of 26 Old 07-27-2014, 08:47 PM
Community Moderator
 
g00gl3it's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,616
Rep Power: 1
  

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

A lot of work to fix, that's for sure... any chance you could weld a threaded rod with a collar in there?

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
2001 XR650R BRP (Big Red Pig)
2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
2007 Honda CB900F (sold)
2006 Honda VTX 1300C (sold)
YouTube Channel
g00gl3it is offline  
post #8 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 05:38 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: town
Posts: 22
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by g00gl3it View Post
A lot of work to fix, that's for sure... any chance you could weld a threaded rod with a collar in there?
I'm going to call a couple of frame shops today and see if it's fixable.

Something else occurred to me, but I don't know if it's just me being paranoid.
Since that cross member is so far gone, could the frame have twisted ever so slighty?
I don't know if just chain torque could do that.

Junker is offline  
post #9 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 06:34 AM
"CERTIFIABLE"
 
Ken Phenix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Southeast Texas
Posts: 1,954
Blog Entries: 1
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage

Awards Showcase
Motorcycle Picture Game Award Extraordinary Ride Extraordinary Ride 
Total Awards: 3

How much $$ do you have in the bike? Odometer reading? Good title or salvage? What's the overall condition and what other maintenance is it likely to need. If there are no other serious issues, I'd be looking for a donor frame. You'll need to do major diss-assembly to properly inspect / repair the damage so it might be better to just swap the good parts over to a later model frame with no rust. Otherwise I'd either part it out or sell it as is.
Ken Phenix is offline  
post #10 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 06:44 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: town
Posts: 22
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Phenix View Post
How much $$ do you have in the bike? Odometer reading? Good title or salvage? What's the overall condition and what other maintenance is it likely to need. If there are no other serious issues, I'd be looking for a donor frame. You'll need to do major diss-assembly to properly inspect / repair the damage so it might be better to just swap the good parts over to a later model frame with no rust. Otherwise I'd either part it out or sell it as is.
I'm in it just under 2K. The title is clear. ODO is right at 50K.
Tanks and gauges need to be replaced for certain and just some small items/cleanup.

Since I would be doing an engine removal to just fix it, I had the same thought to use a clean frame, used or otherwise.
If it were a 'new' frame I would have to surrender the cut stem with VIN to get the new frame stamped, and I think it would be a salvage title, which sucks.
Used frames with clear titles are pricey as hell from what I am seeing.

Kind of a six or half dozen situation.

Junker is offline  
post #11 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 12:54 PM
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Pensacola
Posts: 27
Rep Power: 1
 
Good lord. Hope you don't ride the bike. I was given a 919 that had set outside for over 3 years about a half a mile from the gulf of mexico and it only had superficial rust (easily removed). That looks like a recovery from the titanic.

kingrex is offline  
post #12 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 12:58 PM
Aquilifer
 
rpcraft's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,128
Rep Power: 1
 
Yeah that is some pretty bad rust. I can't imagine how bad the bearings on the wheels and stuff are.... Be sure and check out all the rotating assemblies.

Rob C

88 Blue Hawk (NT650) Project Pics - http://tinyurl.com/clw8h3q
2000 DL650 - Being ridden but make me an offer if interested...
2002 DL1000 V-Strom
rpcraft is offline  
post #13 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 01:06 PM
Tesserarius
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Edison, NJ
Posts: 632
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 1

At 2K I would pass. There are better examples available for a little more money.

arshishb is offline  
post #14 of 26 Old 07-28-2014, 02:05 PM
Milites Gregarius
 
gn83tm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Western Iowa
Posts: 115
Rep Power: 1
 
That's pretty nasty! Probably repairable by a good frame or racing fab shop - provided it doesn't continue on into the other parts of the frame. They may need to remake the brackets as well.

Are there normally drain holes in these tubes or any other way for moisture to get in? Or, are you just in a wet/humid/salty environment where it was attacked from the outside? I'd proceed with a lot of caution on this deal.

gn83tm is offline  
post #15 of 26 Old 07-29-2014, 08:28 AM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 2,260
Rep Power: 1
 
Welding in a new one might not be a huge deal, but I'd be more concerned about how much other rust damage there is.

It could be that every other part of the frame is fine, but it's hard to think that ONE bar would rust out that bad and be the only part rusted.

KarlJay is offline  
post #16 of 26 Old 07-29-2014, 09:10 AM Thread Starter
Tirone
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: town
Posts: 22
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlJay View Post
Welding in a new one might not be a huge deal, but I'd be more concerned about how much other rust damage there is.

It could be that every other part of the frame is fine, but it's hard to think that ONE bar would rust out that bad and be the only part rusted.
I was looking hard at the swingarm frame section and it's suprisingly not at all rusted. Don't know if chain goop protected it over the years or what.

I've found out the bike spent time in NY and perhaps road salt spraying on this one section, combined with a lazy as hell PO, is what led to this severe corrosion.

Going to try and get a new cross member spliced in as soon as possible.

If it's not possible, then perhaps I can buy the cursed Corbin, graft it on and roll this bastard into a burning building. Ha.

Junker is offline  
post #17 of 26 Old 07-29-2014, 10:22 AM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
badmoon692008's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Neenah, WI
Posts: 2,226
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Extraordinary Ride 
Total Awards: 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junker View Post
I was looking hard at the swingarm frame section and it's suprisingly not at all rusted. Don't know if chain goop protected it over the years or what.

I've found out the bike spent time in NY and perhaps road salt spraying on this one section, combined with a lazy as hell PO, is what led to this severe corrosion.

Going to try and get a new cross member spliced in as soon as possible.

If it's not possible, then perhaps I can buy the cursed Corbin, graft it on and roll this bastard into a burning building. Ha.
Man, you learn quick...

Love is the feeling you get when you like something as much as your motorcycle - Hunter S. Thompson
I just mı̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̨ade you wipe your screen.
-2009 Suzuki GSX-R 750 Race Bike
-2007 Honda 919
-1995 Nighthawk 750 (Tboned)
-1983 KZ 440 (Sold)
badmoon692008 is offline  
post #18 of 26 Old 07-29-2014, 11:52 AM
Community Moderator
 
g00gl3it's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,616
Rep Power: 1
  

Awards Showcase
Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance Wrist Twisters Event Attendance 
Total Awards: 3

Look under the lower triple - that area seems to rust quickly.

2009 Aprilia Tuono - Ginger
2001 XR650R BRP (Big Red Pig)
2006 Honda 599 - Ex wrecked it :-D
2007 Honda CB900F (sold)
2006 Honda VTX 1300C (sold)
YouTube Channel
g00gl3it is offline  
post #19 of 26 Old 07-30-2014, 01:37 AM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 2,260
Rep Power: 1
 
I don't know how this area is stressed, however, the engine is a part of the "frame" support system.

You might want to leave the engine in place, remove the front forks, and weld in a cross bar before you cut out the old bar and remove the engine.

A small bar above the old bar won't add much weight and could be remove later if needed.

Another idea would be to just clamp or tack weld a support to hold things in place before you cut the old bar out or remove the engine.

It's kinda the same thing as adding support rods to a car before you remove a structural part.

... again, I don't have any special knowledge about the frame, but if you cut the bar out and remove the engine, the frame could then move a bit and that could cause problems. A simple rod tack welded above the old one could stop that problem.

KarlJay is offline  
post #20 of 26 Old 07-30-2014, 03:00 AM
Centurion
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,310
Rep Power: 1
 
There seems to be a lot of rust on other parts as well. I would be highly suspect of that bike Im afraid.

NZspokes is offline  
post #21 of 26 Old 07-30-2014, 12:01 PM
LackOfCharismaCanBeFatal
 
vukmang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: los angeles
Posts: 85
Rep Power: 1
 
if your bike is insured report it to the insurance company,,,they will be "happy" to pay you for your troubles.
thats why they are called insurance, to insure us when we're in need, coz we pay freaking big monies to them, so its their turn to help when we need them, simple as that.
put a big smile back on your face with their check with your name on it!
P.S. way to big and expensive project to bring your bike to a safe and reliable state...

lack of charisma can be fatal
vukmang is offline  
post #22 of 26 Old 07-30-2014, 12:08 PM
Immune
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: East TN
Posts: 374
Rep Power: 1
 
Frame integrity? That bike seems to be lacking in that dept.

BKRMON is offline  
post #23 of 26 Old 07-05-2015, 07:52 AM
Tirone
 
Tumblin Dice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 14
Rep Power: 1
 
Junker revives his Niner

Update on this thread... My friend Junker is too modest to mention it, so I'm chiming in. The rust damage to the frame was, in fact, isolated to the cross-member with the radiator mounts. This made for a straight forward repair. He was even able to retain the radiator mounts, simplifying the whole process by eliminating tedious alignment issues. Getting the engine in and out was probably the most difficult part for a couple of guys who haven't done it before, but with patience it wasn't too bad. Of course he took advantage and repainted the engine and other various bits, and now has a pretty fine-looking machine! Funds were tight so it didn't all happen at once, but there's one more 919 back on the road!

Tumblin Dice is offline  
post #24 of 26 Old 07-05-2015, 09:02 AM
TEXAN
 
MF1VE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Midland, TX
Posts: 1,524
Rep Power: 1
 
Great news!

Also, pictures. Need 'em.

MF1VE is offline  
post #25 of 26 Old 07-05-2015, 09:13 AM
Tribunus Laticlavius
 
voodooridr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 4,608
Rep Power: 1
 
Happy to hear she could be saved


Dan
voodooridr is offline  
post #26 of 26 Old 07-05-2015, 09:24 AM
Tirone
 
Tumblin Dice's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 14
Rep Power: 1
 
Like I said, Junker's "shy"(modest, whatever...) so no pics.


Gotta respect his wishes, but suffice it to say he really did a great job!

Maybe soon we'll run into some of you guys on The Dragon or thereabouts...

Tumblin Dice is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wrist Twisters forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome