wally, you have some points. givi mig welded those bars for ease of production and cost. mig welds are very hard. had they tig welded them or smaw(arc) they would probably be fine for multiple "hits". but they did their job and saved your cases and let you get home that day. without them you most likely would have had to have the bike towed($$$). so between the case cost and the towing cost you saved money.if you had to replace the clutch cover(case,center cover,rubber gasket and case gasket((no bolts)) you'd be in the $320 range for parts alone vs $140 for the givi's.if you lived closer, i'd weld them for you for free(i don't know what shipping would be from bc to new jersey?? the offer stands if you want to pay shipping) i feel you got your moneys worth,jmho. my suggestion would be to find someone local to weld them for you(probably $20-40us) rattle can them up and reinstall.
i'm not trying to pee in your soup, just offering a different POV.
ps. you know that the crash induced internal stress into the bars then a year of engine vibs and chassis flex finally cracked them.
Well, I have to say that they did a horrible job, MIG or otherwise. There is really no point in TIG welding steel, especially if you are going to do that bad of a job. MIG will do a terrific job on steel and you can save the TIG for finicky metals like Aluminum and magnesium... or when working with thin material thicknesses. I'm progressing from CAD design to CNC and fabrication and if I discovered a MIG welder working for me producing welds like those I would fire him on the spot.
This is a nice MIG (foreground) and TIG (around the cone) weld:
Had the givi welds looked like that, they never would have failed.
The Givi welds look like MIG welds done with CO2 shielding instead of argon with a wire feed rate that was too high. If they refuse to replace them I will demand they return the originals and I will post pictures of proper MIG welds to contrast the existing ones.
A good buddy of mine lives a block away and has an outstanding fab shop in his back yard. It's not about my ability to fix them, it's about the inconvenience associated with having to do so when the company should be standing behind their product.
You are right though, they saved me money and got me home. That said, it would be great if they saved me money again if this situation were to re-arise. I did pay $150, after all, for an assembly line produced product consisting of $10 worth of steel. As I said, I'm on my way into the fabrication business and I would be ashamed to have my name on a product like this and would happily replace an item in this instance just to keep my customers happy.
The crash didn't induce THAT much stress. It was the Vibs that did it.
I value your input and appreciate your offer to help out. Commendable sir
I'm not trying to be an ass for the sake of being an ass. I believe that holding companies responsible for their products helps us all in the long run. Especially the uninformed consumers.
bending a piece of steel back and forth fails because it is taken past its yeild strength, entering its "plastic" state. All I'm saying is that there is a good chance the crash put too much strain on the mounting brackets.
I've taken a few welding classes myself, and have the pleasure of owning a nice tig machine, so when it comes to welds, I can tell you that those do not appear to be of poor quality. The main thing to look for in the above pictures is whether or not they burned away at the tubing walls when they did the welds... and from the pictures you show the welds do not seem to have eaten away at the tubing wall... While it is typically true that a welded piece does not fail at the weld, I have (in many cases) seen it fail just after the weld (which I think is the case here). It just so happened that the weld was also located at the point of greatest stress.
If you wanted to make these things better, then just have a gusset welded to each mounting tab. You can put the biggest/baddest weld ontop of theirs, and next time you take a fall it will crack just above that weld. I just don't think you are the victim in this case, and going after the company isn't going to get you anywhere. Now go make it better and post up a "how too" while you're at it.
"Work hardening, also known as strain hardening or cold working, is the strengthening of a metal by plastic deformation."
Pushing a metal past it's yield strength once does not work harden it enough to significantly compromise it's integrity when working with something like mild steel. If that were the case we would be unable to bend or shape steel without it snapping. Extruded aluminum on the other hand is a good example of a metal which will not tolerate this manipulation.
I hate to say it but if you don't think those welds look bad you may have to hit the books a little more.