electronic ohlins?! calling LDH - Wrist Twisters
 
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post #1 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:21 PM Thread Starter
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electronic ohlins?! calling LDH

Soooo LDH, When can we see one for the 919? LOL

That thing seems pretty freaking awesome. I doubt I'd need one. Have you ever tried one of these ldh?




An Íhlins

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post #2 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:26 PM
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Wow, that thing is cool!!!

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The Íhlins Mechatronic suspension for the Kawasaki ZX-10R includes a TTX36 MkII shock absorber, fitted with Íhlins EC actuators that are wired to an Íhlins ECU. The system is connected to the ZX-10R’s ECU, using signals from it to determine rider intentions by monitoring the way in which the bike is ridden: throttle position, rpm range, wheel speed, etc.. The Íhlins Mechatronic system reacts to the rider’s quantitative needs, as revealed by the actual riding dynamics. The semi-active Mechatronic suspension continuously changes the damping settings dependent on the aggressiveness of riding style. All of the Mechatronic’s adjustments occur while riding, but the system also detects the rider’s choice of Power Mode, selected with the OEM-supplied button on the bike, automatically changing the suspension to sportier settings.
Damn that thing is more high tech and sophisticated than the entire 919!
Quote:
MSRP: $1,625.00
That's it?! I was thinking at least $5k.... LDH report in asap!

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post #3 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:41 PM Thread Starter
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I know! I was expecting it to be sooo much more money. Hell, if this thing can hook up to the honda ecu, I'll sell my ohlins and buy one of these

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post #4 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:48 PM Thread Starter
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I found this in Cycle world magazine

check out the article

Scan0001.jpg



If you can not read it I can scan it to a pdf. It might look better

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post #5 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:49 PM
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It is absolutely nothing short of amazing on the 2011+ ZX-10R, but don't hold your breath for these to materialize for older bikes... Right off the bat the ECU's have to be smart enough to interface and that is a very recent advancement.

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post #6 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:52 PM Thread Starter
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Well if it does, just let us know. Still, VERY cool

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post #7 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boogunoogun View Post
I know! I was expecting it to be sooo much more money. Hell, if this thing can hook up to the honda ecu, I'll sell my ohlins and buy one of these
I'll admit this one is above me, but gonna throw it out there cuz I thought the same thing. Not sure how it would work with the 919 ECU since it doesn't have any sensors to gather data on riding dyamics, power modes, wheel spin detection, etc. As far as I know, the 919 ecu only reads map sensor, tilt, F.I., throttle, rpm, and? Does it read speed? would gear number be needed as well? I would love for LDH to chime in on this.

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post #8 of 13 Old 01-19-2013, 11:19 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah I have no idea how the thing works. If it could work with less info, or if there is a way to get a retrofit module and add sensors. But like LDH said, it will probably never happen.

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post #9 of 13 Old 01-20-2013, 12:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LDH View Post
It is absolutely nothing short of amazing on the 2011+ ZX-10R, but don't hold your breath for these to materialize for older bikes... Right off the bat the ECU's have to be smart enough to interface and that is a very recent advancement.
You're breaking my heart!

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post #10 of 13 Old 01-21-2013, 10:48 AM
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Pfft. $1600? I can snatch these up on eBay all day for ~$500...

FYI, it comes with an additional fuel reservoir (.2 gallons)...

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post #11 of 13 Old 01-21-2013, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LDH View Post
It is absolutely nothing short of amazing on the 2011+ ZX-10R, but don't hold your breath for these to materialize for older bikes... Right off the bat the ECU's have to be smart enough to interface and that is a very recent advancement.
Recent for motorcycles, but not for cars. Up 'till now motorcycles haven't needed to go to Controller Area Network (CAN) protocol for the simple reason that there is little advantage to it: for cars it's primarily a way to save weight by eliminating up to 75% of the wires, and to make troubleshooting much easier with a brand specific diagnostic tester that can activate practically any electrical device. Of course the electronics are much more complex, but you can't do anything but replace them anyway, so why not?

In the case of older FI bikes the only way to interface to the Ohlins shock ECU is to translate the ECU analog / digital input signals to CAN compatible codes (not too difficult as the majority of those functions are on one chip), that is as long as you already know the handshake codes for each sensor -- not something the factory is overly willing to share.

On the other hand, a control unit monitoring throttle position, speed, and RPM inputs, along with board mounted accelerometers reading positive and negative acceleration and lean angles can process the data, address control maps, and actuate stepper motors controllers (Again, a single chip job) to adjust the damping rates. Given the relatively limited market it is unlikely in the near future.

Lastly, it may be possible to manually set damping with the push of a button or turn of a dial, but you lose the automatic functions that are the main point of this sort of system.

Recently, using information gleaned from Works Performance, I have been experimenting with dampers using electrorheological (ER) fluids which can react in as little as 2 to 5 milliseconds, making a near full active system. Of course there will have to be a pretty sophisticated control unit to fully utilize this, but that's one of my specialities. The advantage? Adjustments can be made considerably faster than the stepper motors can slew -- worst case 5 milliseconds for an ER based systems versus 100 to 400 milliseconds necessary for the steppers, depending on how far the needle valves have to go. This enables adjustments for any given supspension movement up to 200 in/sec (a maximum rate shock absorber designers use as a benchmark) in real time, and possibly more, which would make even sharp bumps such as expansion joints on a freeway practically indiscernable.

At any rate it will take lots of time and datalogging to get to a marketable system, so in the meantime the Ohlins is a good start. I just wish they would make a control unit for pre CAN FI bikes.

Rob

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post #12 of 13 Old 01-21-2013, 05:44 PM
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You are an expert with control systems too?!! We use CANbus at work in some of our embedded systems and the above post makes me want to dive a little into the CAN protocol...



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post #13 of 13 Old 01-22-2013, 06:52 PM
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Sounds like Rob needs to get busy working on a little black box to go along with that shock so us old school bike guys can get with the times.

Too bad for ohlines that Delphi has all the petents for MR dampers. That would be sweet to have on a bike. Not sure how much more an MR damper weighs with all those magnets and windings. Might be less than stepper motors, might be more.

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