The official BMW thread - Wrist Twisters
 
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post #1 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 07:24 AM Thread Starter
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The official BMW thread

So I had a bad experience at a dealer. I went to see the new 800's and was ignored. Went to the Chicago cycle show and sat on both the s and the st.
The ergonomics seemed pretty comfortable.
(Was looking at the FJR when I bought the 9'er.) Didn't want to spend 13 grand and thought the new b'mers might fit the bill.

Odd note: April Motor Trend had a cop car shootout and they threw in an R 1200 RT-P Just ot mix it up.

Questions:

What is all the hullabaloo about with these boxer boobed brit bikes ?
What are the reliability / support factors.

I bought the 919 over a triumph due to shop availability.
p.s. I thought the rockster was cool.

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post #2 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 08:38 AM
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they still offer the Rockster? They used one in a really bad Bond film, eek!

<- expert? no.
<- afficianado? yes.

I think you're asking about boxer engines??

But where do the Brits come in? BMW is Bavarian, you know German. Brits have bad teeth and pasty skin, Germans are thin and angry.

Anywhoo, before the numbskulls get in here and start bashing for bashing's sake let's talk BMW. BMW has its origins in aircraft design however the Versailles Peace Treaty banned aircraft engine production in Germany in 1919. BMW was already using the Boxer (flat opposed) engines and needed something else to do, so they parlayed their experience into building motorcycle engines in 1920 and began supplying engines to Victoria (a bike manufacturer) in 1921.

The boxer engine has gone through reconfigurations over the years but has remained essentially the same. It is a tried and true proven design.

The 800cc bikes you were looking at are not boxer engines. BMW denotes boxer engined bikes with the first letter "R" in the bike name, example R1200GS, R1150GS, R1200S, etc. "K" bikes are I4 engines and "F" bikes are 800 twins or 650 thumpers.

Reliability? I will only speak from what I know from my R1200GS... approaching 12000 miles in 2 years it has run flawlessly. I will be taking it in for a 12000 mile service and the valves will be adjusted and the throttle bodies synched as well as the fluids changed and brakes inspected & R&R'd if needed.

Some BMWs are quite simple with very little to break, others are very complex with active engine monitoring systems and safety features. My bike has power linked ABS brakes, it applies braking force to both the front and rear wheels by activating only the hand lever. I've tested the ABS and it works as described by BMW. And yes, believe it or not, my +500lb adventurebike WILL stop shorter than any sportbike I've ever ridden (and I've ridden most of them).

Money? Yep, nothing BMW affiliated is cheap. But there's no reason you can't put 80,000 miles on a well serviced & maintained R1200GS and still sell it for money instead of begging someone to come pick it up.


Yes, I'd buy another one tomorrow if I needed to. Your dealer sucked, sorry. My dealer rocks and is far and away better than any of my japanese bike dealers.

About what else could I go into specifics?

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post #3 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 11:32 AM Thread Starter
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Brit bikes. My bad. What do you think of the new 800s ? I thought what I read said that both pistons move together though they're on different strokes. I should think that would be worse than a harley save counterweighted cranks. Thanks for not hangin' me out there.

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post #4 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 11:34 AM
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Brit bikes are the best. I'd own one if I could afford it.

I like steak and kidney pie too.

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post #5 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemonhead View Post
Brit bikes. My bad. What do you think of the new 800s ? I thought what I read said that both pistons move together though they're on different strokes. I should think that would be worse than a harley save counterweighted cranks. Thanks for not hangin' me out there.
I like their compact design. I'm curious how they avoid being a filling loosener. They used counter balancing as a selling point on their big bikes. Probably the design tolerances are so tight on the smaller engine it's LESS of an issue...but I'd test ride one first. My BMW Dealer is very testride friendly as long as YOU have ample insurance. I should wear a nice suit, go visit them and find some answers.

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post #6 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 11:52 AM
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The local shop is not much different than Lemonhead's description. They do not entertain, nor greet you until you go to swing a leg over one of their floor models. Then they are on you like flies. I have seen them give test rides, and some of the floor models have obvious wear marks from riding. I have yet to try and force the issue with them though. The BMW's hold a special place with me, and it's one of those desires that is yearned for, but never achieved. My mind is a hard one to change, and I find myself being drawn further away from the Jap bikes constantly.

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post #7 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 11:53 AM Thread Starter
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I'm in Kenosha. They're in Milwaukee. Good reason for a ride, yes?

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post #8 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
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I'm in Kenosha. They're in Milwaukee. Good reason for a ride, yes?
That's a great excuse for a little ride. Before walking in their store wipe all the bugs off.

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post #9 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 12:07 PM
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In all seriousness, BMW makes a good bike. When I was looking at the K1200R at BMW of Manhattan, they offered to let me take it for a test ride. That is unheard of out here, no one lets you test ride bikes. I didn't take them up on it because I didn't have my helmet with me and wasn't about to bring it to work on the train.

The point is that they let you test ride their bikes. So if you're serious about buying one, take it for a test ride first.

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post #10 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 02:10 PM
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I have to admit, I came close to buying a GS a couple years ago. Our local BMW shop has the nicest staff and the sharpest service techs in the area.

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post #11 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 02:40 PM Thread Starter
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Trip cancelled due to lack of visibility. Fine mist outside the shield. Warm breath inside. Took the nine off-roading and now I have to rinse it off when it cools weather

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post #12 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 03:19 PM
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Lemonhead - I am in the Milwaukee area and I have a friend I worked and rode with who is a BMW fanatic. Last count he had 4 and one was a vintage he restored that he claimed was quite rare... according to him was the first "sport oriented" bike made... I wasnt listening at the time because I was busy staring at my new RC51 I think... 2 of his 4 bikes had over 150k miles on them and his Dad was even a BMW guy who had one he was trying to clear 200k with.

Anyway - what stealer are you talking to or are planning to talk to? I know he was pretty tight with a place and could get me a name and contact there if your coming up here looking.

Let me know your plans...

And sorry I was slow to read this... but you know... BMW.... comon... you gotta be pretty bored to read a BMW thread!

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post #13 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 03:35 PM Thread Starter
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Sadly, yes I am bored. Stupid weather. If I could see, I'd be riding. Thanks for the "inside", Midwest. Mebbe I'll Pm you sometime and we'll meet someplace, I dunno, Milwaukeeish? I gotta go do my truck dirivin' thing and make some money. gah.

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post #14 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 05:11 PM
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I'm thinking about picking up a K1200S. Kevin, who is your dealer?

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post #15 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 06:18 PM
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www.bmwrides.com in Odessa, FL.

Good to see you Geremy.

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post #16 of 37 Old 04-26-2007, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemonhead View Post
p.s. I thought the rockster was cool.
I test rode a Rockster at Chicago BMW right before I bought my 919. Loved it! LOTS of $$, but sweet!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jetblast10 View Post
Germans are thin and angry.
Hey! Ok, I'm German. Ok, my body fat index is below average. But Dammit!! I'M NOT ANGRY!!!! :saddam: GRRRR!!!sama:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemonhead View Post
Sadly, yes I am bored. Stupid weather. If I could see, I'd be riding. Thanks for the "inside", Midwest. Mebbe I'll Pm you sometime and we'll meet someplace, I dunno, Milwaukeeish?
Since I'm only an hour south of Kenosha, post up and maybe we can "Swarm" the beemer dealer.

I plan to die young, as late as possible.
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post #17 of 37 Old 04-27-2007, 08:17 AM Thread Starter
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Midwest, Semi gray ?

What say today ?

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post #18 of 37 Old 04-27-2007, 10:43 AM
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What, today? Don't you have a job?

I plan to die young, as late as possible.
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post #19 of 37 Old 04-27-2007, 10:48 AM Thread Starter
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I do. It's just not a 9-5 IT job like the rest of the world seems to have. I own my own truck and I say who I say when I say....who.

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post #20 of 37 Old 04-27-2007, 12:34 PM
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Ummmm... I am a M-F half days.... 7 till 7!

Of course I have a ton of freedom... SO - you never know. Just right now I am swamped as we lost 1 guy and another next Friday. Guess who gets all their work?

What dealer are you looking at heading to? My buddy knows a guy over on 76th and just south of Silver Spring. I can get a name...

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post #21 of 37 Old 04-29-2007, 07:37 PM
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I'm trying to decide between a boxer and a K bike (R1200S and K1200S) and need some real first hand info. Boston/Cambridge has a LOT of stop & go and low speed bumper-to-bumper stuff. I have heard that the K bikes don't do well in those situations, but I haven't really heard anything about the new R. I like the fact that the R has no radiator, less maintenance to worry about. I will test ride both bikes before I buy but I wanted to know what others think.

Kevin: does your dealer give you good deals on gear? I'm about to pull the trigger on the BMW reflect jacket.

Thanks.

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post #22 of 37 Old 04-29-2007, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geremy View Post
I'm trying to decide between a boxer and a K bike (R1200S and K1200S) and need some real first hand info. Boston/Cambridge has a LOT of stop & go and low speed bumper-to-bumper stuff. I have heard that the K bikes don't do well in those situations, but I haven't really heard anything about the new R. I like the fact that the R has no radiator, less maintenance to worry about. I will test ride both bikes before I buy but I wanted to know what others think.

Kevin: does your dealer give you good deals on gear? I'm about to pull the trigger on the BMW reflect jacket.

Thanks.
It's no contest given the K bike's modern wet clutch, water cooled, and 160HP!

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post #23 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 04:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geremy View Post
Kevin: does your dealer give you good deals on gear? I'm about to pull the trigger on the BMW reflect jacket.
No, we don't have that type of relationship. I can get some deals on Fieldsheer products because I'm a dealer for those but that's about the extent of my reach.


The K and R bikes are not the proverbial apples and oranges to be compared for the same objectives. If you want an apple, eat an apple not an orange. Totally different bikes, totally different feel, totally different everything except the BMW roundel.

Personally I would not own a K bike for daily use, but that's me at almost 40 with no need to impress anyone or go obscenely fast on the streets. The K12S is not a trackbike either so you can forget about that. Think of it as a tamed hayabusa for grownups.


Depending on your uses Geremy, if you're going to be stuck in stop & go gridlock maybe an urban assault bike would be worth looking at?

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post #24 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 05:44 AM
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An urban assault bike is definately worth looking at, and I am keeping my options open...everything from Triumph S3s, 919s, KTM 990, Multistrada, Hypermotard, the list goes on.

The appealing thing about the BMWs is the low upkeep and comfort. I don't really want a trackbike, and I don't want to have to go out to the garage everyday to work on the bike either. The shaft drive I see as a real advantage.

Heated grips and plug for a heated vest are also VERY appealing here. I'm assuming that whatever I buy will be used in place of a car for almost all of my needs, 1-up only, throughout most of the year with an aerostitch. When we get a snowstorm or the roads are crap I'll have my wife drive me around in our Touareg. The anti-lock brakes would also be a worthwhile option to have. Boston weather is crap. For that matter, the bike will need to be well built because I don't intend on keeping it very clean in the winter. It's too freakin cold to polish things outside.

I posted the question originally because I would like to know which bike can do the trawling snail pace without being too hard on my clutch hand and not to jumpy. I'm pretty sure it is the boxer but want to be sure.

Right now the two top bikes are the R1200S and the Triumph S3. Very different, I know, but I haven't read that many dissenting opinions about either!

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post #25 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 05:54 AM
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Throw the Moto Guzzi's in there for the shaft drive option.

Edit: and the dry clutch.

Only reason I say the Guzzi is my local dealer has started carrying them, and that is a beautiful bike. Griso, Breva, Norge, and rumors have it they are working on a lighter ADV type bike.

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post #26 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 06:14 AM
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the dry clutch on the boxer is more car-like than bike-like. The upright high seated position of a R1200GS along with linked abs & the ammenities make it (imo) a perfect commuter. Weight is it's only disadvantage.

If I was forced to trade right now into something other than a BMW, but to be used the same way, it'd be the multistrada. But I would have to be forced to make that trade.

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post #27 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 07:25 AM
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When bike shopping I came across an abundance of dry clutch models with free scratches for great bargains.

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post #28 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 07:53 AM Thread Starter
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The new 800s ? Anyone ?

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post #29 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 07:56 AM Thread Starter
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Geremy, I'm gonna get boooooed for this but, I'm sure you can do better than a niner. If I had it to do over...... My wifes pissed because I'm thinking about a trade over to a used 'strom. Gonna keep looking.

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post #30 of 37 Old 04-30-2007, 08:16 AM
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Never trade! Keep the old and add more to the collection!

2 > 4
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post #31 of 37 Old 05-01-2007, 10:49 AM
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I think I'm just going to get the Triumph S3. I like the looks, plus it seems to be pretty comfortable and should do well in the city.

It doesn't have shaft drives, ABS or heated grips, but I won't have to take out a loan either!

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post #32 of 37 Old 05-01-2007, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
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I think I'm just going to get the Triumph S3. I like the looks, plus it seems to be pretty comfortable and should do well in the city.

It doesn't have shaft drives, ABS or heated grips, but I won't have to take out a loan either!
You got my vote! You can easily add heated grips, and loans are a waste of gas money.

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post #33 of 37 Old 05-01-2007, 10:57 AM
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Shaft Drive without breaking the bank:

MSRP $8,500

Not nearly a hooligan bike like the S3, but unique nonetheless. I dig the S3 as well. After seeing and hearing Simpson's bike, I was duly impressed. Snap some pics of your new ride when you get it.

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post #34 of 37 Old 05-01-2007, 11:56 AM
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Moto Guzzis seem nice, but they aren't really my style and I would worry about parts and reliability.

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post #35 of 37 Old 05-01-2007, 12:08 PM
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This is the latest thing from Moto Guzzi, pretty sexy little number if you ask me..


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post #36 of 37 Old 05-17-2007, 01:05 PM
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I checked out the 800ST today! Very light, 85HP should be adequate with excellent MPG. efficient belt drive, wet clutch, twin is well counter balanced. I'm years away from changing bikes, but wanted to let Lemonhead know I like it! I won't test ride it though...because I may not be able to retain myself.

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post #37 of 37 Old 05-17-2007, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dream247919 View Post
I checked out the 800ST today! Very light, 85HP should be adequate with excellent MPG. efficient belt drive, wet clutch, twin is well counter balanced. I'm years away from changing bikes, but wanted to let Lemonhead know I like it! I won't test ride it though...because I may not be able to retain myself.
Contrasting the 800ST to the 9r. +$4K, -15HP, and higher maintenance cost. The trip confirms my bike remains a fantastic bargain.
However the K1200GT is their crowning achievement as the definitive ST. I wonder what will have changed on it when my bike wears out...ok that's too far out...in ten years.

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