WTH! Honda Hornet 250? - Wrist Twisters
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post #1 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 04:40 PM Thread Starter
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WTH! Honda Hornet 250?


Yeah...so I saw this today and said....WTF? A Hornet..that's a 250? I thought it only went down to the 599's......interesting.
Only in Japan.

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post #2 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 05:28 PM
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I think there's a 400 as well

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post #3 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 06:32 PM Thread Starter
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wait wait wait....WTH?
A Honda Hornet 250, 400, 599, and 919?
Whats going on here folks.

Why don't we have the 250 and the 400 here in the US?

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1984 Yamaha Seca 400
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Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
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post #4 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 06:52 PM
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You really have to ask? cause US likes big excessive things :P

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Originally Posted by VintageHunter View Post
wait wait wait....WTH?
A Honda Hornet 250, 400, 599, and 919?
Whats going on here folks.

Why don't we have the 250 and the 400 here in the US?
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post #5 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 06:54 PM Thread Starter
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I know.....about the U.S.
but I had to ask......again.

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1984 Yamaha Seca 400
1984 Honda CB125
1987 Yamaha RZ350
Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
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post #6 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 07:03 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ewmin3m View Post
You really have to ask? cause US likes big excessive things :P
it's such a shame that the U.S. Honda Corps have lost their way when it comes to small displacement bikes.
Nothin' more fun(er) than to take a grown man, stuff him on a TZR250 and watch him rip thru twisties in the Canyons.

Shame...total shame. We've lost that perspective on the way we "once" rode the land.

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1984 Yamaha Seca 400
1984 Honda CB125
1987 Yamaha RZ350
Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
1998 Yamaha R1 (first original R1)
2006 Kawasaki Ninja 250
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post #7 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
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I mean I've argued this point a 1000 times with folks...............theres NOTHING you can do with a 1000cc bike here in the U.S. You can't even push that darn thing to it's maximum potential let alone ride it properly.

Hows the saying go........."Better to go fast on a slow bike than to go slow on a fast bike"............er....something like that.
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1984 Yamaha Seca 400
1984 Honda CB125
1987 Yamaha RZ350
Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
1998 Yamaha R1 (first original R1)
2006 Kawasaki Ninja 250
1997 Kawasaki ZX7
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post #8 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 07:49 PM
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The 250 was first.

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post #9 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
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The 250 was first what?

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1984 Honda CB125
1987 Yamaha RZ350
Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
1998 Yamaha R1 (first original R1)
2006 Kawasaki Ninja 250
1997 Kawasaki ZX7
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post #10 of 61 Old 03-01-2017, 10:46 PM
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Is that thing a 4cyl? A hornet with a 4cyl fireblade motor on it would be bonkers....

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post #11 of 61 Old 03-02-2017, 03:04 AM
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We have the honda cb250 hornet in Australia. It is popular with learner riders.
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post #12 of 61 Old 03-02-2017, 06:11 AM
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There's tons of examples of that in other countries... there's a "gixxer" 150, gsxr 400, etc...
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post #13 of 61 Old 03-02-2017, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VintageHunter View Post
it's such a shame that the U.S. Honda Corps have lost their way when it comes to small displacement bikes.
Nothin' more fun(er) than to take a grown man, stuff him on a TZR250 and watch him rip thru twisties in the Canyons.

Shame...total shame. We've lost that perspective on the way we "once" rode the land.
The new CBR250RR seems like it will be a blast. Supposedly may become a 300 if/when it arrives in the US.

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post #14 of 61 Old 03-02-2017, 12:22 PM Thread Starter
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ahung12:
where are you from? we have here in the states (USA) the Honda 300.
Is the Honda CBR250RR a different bike than the Honda 300?
Wondering.

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post #15 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 06:51 AM
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I'm in the US too. Yup *if* we get a small RR it'd be different than the 300R that we've already got. Or so that's what I read. So maybe the 300R will be totally replaced by the RR? Not sure there's room in the US two two small sportbikes from the same manufacturer.

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post #16 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 07:19 AM Thread Starter
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wheres the article that you read bout the small RR?
can you post the link?

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post #17 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 02:20 PM
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There's quite a few out there but in terms of reputable sources this is probably the most recent.

Honda CBR250RR Easily Exceeds 100 MPH in Early Tests MotorcycleDaily.com ? Motorcycle News, Editorials, Product Reviews and Bike Reviews

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post #18 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 02:37 PM Thread Starter
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they should have made it an inline4...instead.
shame.....bring back the in-line4's with gear driven cams............then Honda will have something no other manufacturer can catch.
Shame indeed.

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post #19 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 02:43 PM
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Isn't there a reason why others don't do gear driven cams and I4's are so rare though?

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post #20 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 02:48 PM Thread Starter
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Because the big motorcycle Japanese manuf. have gotten lazy. They don't care about producing a sweet-sounding, inline4 with gear driven cams anymore. Sure you can try (and mind you I'm saying "try" cause you wont convince me of that)....and justify that the "tooling" would be prohibitive but that's just a big BS!
Honda has plenty plenty of funds, resources, sponsors etc....to be able to make a small displacement cc bike that brings back the great engineering of the 80's............but they have become complacent and lazy. Period.

I have Honda CB1 1989, inline4, gear-driven cam 400cc motorcycle and it's the sweetest thing since honey on top of pancake syrup........it's a fine work of engineering marvel yet Honda refuses to delve into that kind of engineering bravery any longer...........like I said...........shame on Honda.
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Isn't there a reason why others don't do gear driven cams and I4's are so rare though?
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1984 Yamaha Seca 400
1984 Honda CB125
1987 Yamaha RZ350
Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
1998 Yamaha R1 (first original R1)
2006 Kawasaki Ninja 250
1997 Kawasaki ZX7
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post #21 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 03:14 PM
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Had 2 of those in the past... Really nice bikes... loud as F*@K :P
Would love to get another to have it as a project bike. Turn it into a small racer with more modern components and a rebuilt/cleaned up engine.
One day... One day....

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Because the big motorcycle Japanese manuf. have gotten lazy. They don't care about producing a sweet-sounding, inline4 with gear driven cams anymore. Sure you can try (and mind you I'm saying "try" cause you wont convince me of that)....and justify that the "tooling" would be prohibitive but that's just a big BS!
Honda has plenty plenty of funds, resources, sponsors etc....to be able to make a small displacement cc bike that brings back the great engineering of the 80's............but they have become complacent and lazy. Period.

I have Honda CB1 1989, inline4, gear-driven cam 400cc motorcycle and it's the sweetest thing since honey on top of pancake syrup........it's a fine work of engineering marvel yet Honda refuses to delve into that kind of engineering bravery any longer...........like I said...........shame on Honda.

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post #22 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 05:29 PM
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The engine looks like a wonderful piece of jewelry.

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post #23 of 61 Old 03-03-2017, 08:11 PM Thread Starter
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Agreed.......the engine "is" a jewel.

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Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
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post #24 of 61 Old 03-04-2017, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VintageHunter View Post
Because the big motorcycle Japanese manuf. have gotten lazy. They don't care about producing a sweet-sounding, inline4 with gear driven cams anymore. Sure you can try (and mind you I'm saying "try" cause you wont convince me of that)....and justify that the "tooling" would be prohibitive but that's just a big BS!
Or maybe gear driven cams are just outdated... The future of the internal combustion engine will be camless. It's that simple.

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post #25 of 61 Old 03-04-2017, 07:08 PM Thread Starter
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Pvster:
if you don't have cams, and you don't have a chain drive system, what then?
explain your synopsis.
I personally think its the latter. Honda and the other big jap makers got lazy. They felt the U.S. market didnt like the smaller cc, well made motorcycles and went to the 1000+cc because of big "Texas" mentality regarding "bigger is better"...............which is a totally wrong mindset to have but who am I to argue with what a "consumer" wants in a motorcycle.

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Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
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2006 Kawasaki Ninja 250
1997 Kawasaki ZX7
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post #26 of 61 Old 03-04-2017, 07:11 PM
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post #27 of 61 Old 03-04-2017, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
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Pvster:
if you don't have cams, and you don't have a chain drive system, what then?
explain your synopsis.
I personally think its the latter. Honda and the other big jap makers got lazy. They felt the U.S. market didnt like the smaller cc, well made motorcycles and went to the 1000+cc because of big "Texas" mentality regarding "bigger is better"...............which is a totally wrong mindset to have but who am I to argue with what a "consumer" wants in a motorcycle.
What Bryce said. You're not paying attention are you? Cams are reaching their maximum potential.

Despite your misconceptions, u.s. consumers want bikes as toys, not as a means of transport. The bigger and harder they can swing their dicks, the quicker they will depart with their cash. Cuz merica. People like you and I, as well as the majority of the people on this board know and think otherwise.

I'd love for Honda to reproduce and modernize the screaming 250 but alas, they won't. I am still hoping for a 600-800 c.c. with 60+ ft lbs and around 100 hp while weighing in at less than 375 lbs. That would be a hoot! They could easily make it. But alas, they won't.

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post #28 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 06:16 AM
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You guys do know that Honda has a whole line of small displacement bikes for the US? The Cb300f, Cbr300, Crf250L, Grom and the Rebel 300? The 300 bikes are 286cc displacement. They also have a series of 500 bikes that are actually 471cc. Not sure what planet you guys are on or what you've been smoking but look again.

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post #29 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 06:26 AM
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Quote:
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Despite your misconceptions, u.s. consumers want bikes as toys, not as a means of transport. The bigger and harder they can swing their dicks, the quicker they will depart with their cash. Cuz merica. People like you and I, as well as the majority of the people on this board know and think otherwise.
Says the guy who bought a Tuono for commuting..

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post #30 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 07:52 AM
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You guys do know that Honda has a whole line of small displacement bikes for the US? The Cb300f, Cbr300, Crf250L, Grom and the Rebel 300? The 300 bikes are 286cc displacement. They also have a series of 500 bikes that are actually 471cc. Not sure what planet you guys are on or what you've been smoking but look again.
You might want to relook the 300s from Honda. They are thumpers and are the laughing stock of the small bike cateogry. If vintage should be berating Honda for laziness, this would be the one area Honda rightfully deserves to be berated. More so when Honda had bikes in the past that were inline 4s with 16k+ rev limit and would put the new 300s which btw is 20-30 years newer, to shame within the first lap, instantly. The crf250 has the same excuse of an engine, need I say more? Then there's the weight: 357 lbs for the cbr300 with one cylinder. What a joke of a porker.

The 500s are much better. But to be fair, a lot of the specs could have easily been fitted to the 300s and put out even better performance. A lot of them were neutered for restricted cc markets. However, 423 lbs is very porkly for a 500cc with only 47 hp. A massive Honda failure. Or laziness, I could accept that argument as well.

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Says the guy who bought a Tuono for commuting..
But not the v4 1000cc or the v4 1100cc. Or a hyabusa for that matter. What's your point? I wanted something very different after having an inline Japanese bike for well over 7 years.

The 919 was clearly not meant to be a commuter by Honda's design, god forbid. Let's berate all the 919 owners that used theirs for commuting. Or adventure riding for that matter.
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post #31 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 08:07 AM
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But not the v4 1000cc or the v4 1100cc. Or a hyabusa for that matter. What's your point? I wanted something very different after having an inline Japanese bike for well over 7 years.

The 919 was clearly not meant to be a commuter by Honda's design, god forbid. Let's berate all the 919 owners that used theirs for commuting. Or adventure riding for that matter.
I'm just simply pointing out your contradiction to your own statements. That and the fact that people think Honda isn't making a range of bikes. They have a very wide range in fact, even here in the US. Who said anything about 919 owners? I have one in the stall. It's not going anywhere. Even after the new Explorer. Which does EVERYTHING better than the 919.

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post #32 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 08:18 AM
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I'm just simply pointing out your contradiction to your own statements. That and the fact that people think Honda isn't making a range of bikes. They have a very wide range in fact, even here in the US. Who said anything about 919 owners? I have one in the stall. It's not going anywhere. Even after the new Explorer. Which does EVERYTHING better than the 919.
What's the contradiction? Did I buy the biggest, baddest, fastest, most spec ready bike with the hype so I could swing my dick at any other rider that could pose a challenge to my bike?

I bought a bike that is 2 generations old and has been out of production for 6 years. Again, what's the contradiction?

The topic isn't whether Honda is making a range of bikes. The topic is whether Honda is making a range of bikes that they are actually trying to improve upon with performance and features as opposed to just making bikes for the sake of sales. Their 20 year old streetbike 250 outshines their current 300 streetbike. That says a lot.

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post #33 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 08:25 AM
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People like you and I, as well as the majority of the people on this board know and think otherwise.
Forget it man. Swing away

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post #34 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
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Forget it man. Swing away
That statement you quoted was in reference to people with the mentality that they needed to buy the biggest, baddest, newest toys. Not about the Honda line up. If I'm understanding correctly, I think you're getting the two mixed up?

You made the accusation, I'd like to discuss it and see what the issue is.

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post #35 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
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That statement you quoted was in reference to people with the mentality that they needed to buy the biggest, baddest, newest toys. Not about the Honda line up. If I'm understanding correctly, I think you're getting the two mixed up?

You made the accusation, I'd like to discuss it and see what the issue is.
Yes, I first quoted what you stated that Murica wants the biggest and baddest. Then went on to say that this wasn't the way that you and other people here thought, but you bought a Tuono after owning a 919 for years. Neither of which are small displacement. That is the contradiction.

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post #36 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 11:02 AM
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Yes, I first quoted what you stated that Murica wants the biggest and baddest. Then went on to say that this wasn't the way that you and other people here thought, but you bought a Tuono after owning a 919 for years. Neither of which are small displacement. That is the contradiction.
It's not a contradiction when neither the 919 or v2 Tuono were the biggest or baddest. Is a 919 or v2 Tuono owner (the majority on this board) a reflection of the biggest/baddest mindset?

Where's the contradiction? I'm still not following.

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post #37 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 11:26 AM Thread Starter
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Agreed on the current 300's and 500's in the Honda lineup.
They suck. Mostly for the Taiwan market. Again, they suck.
And agreed also on the 20-30 year old 250's and 400's from Honda. That's what I was trying to express.
That Honda has lost it's edge in making "good, quality, small displacement bikes" these days.
They make small bikes that are crap. Simple as that.
What ever happened to the CBR400RR? that was a wonderful machine, yet they (Honda Corp) has lost sight of what is it that makes a bike have "soul".

Oh...and Pvster, I am paying attention, are you?

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post #38 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 11:32 AM
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It's not a contradiction when neither the 919 or v2 Tuono were the biggest or baddest. Is a 919 or v2 Tuono owner (the majority on this board) a reflection of the biggest/baddest mindset?

Where's the contradiction? I'm still not following.
Lol. You stated you and other people here want smaller displacement bikes but you spend your money otherwise. Forget it! Go for a ride!

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post #39 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VintageHunter View Post
Oh...and Pvster, I am paying attention, are you?
That was in reference to cam less engines. The technology is really coming up and will be quite amazing. Actuators doing all the lifting will unlock a lot of new designs and add potential. They may even allow for multiple engine designs to be merged and reap the benefits of both designs.

While I hate how computerized engines have become, there's no going back.

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post #40 of 61 Old 03-05-2017, 11:42 AM Thread Starter
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Agreed on the computerized engines. I dislike them too. Agreed on the fact that they (the computerization of engines) are not going away.
Soon, perhaps in our lifetime, we'll see young bucks only talking about "Lithium-Ion motorcycle engines".
Gone like the doo-doo bird will be the way of carburated and even FI engines......it's definitely a 'brave new world' with this technology emergence.
Thing I find difficult about those computerized components on a motorcycle is that you have to be an electrical engineer, rocket-scientist, chemical-engineer, to even work on your bike. Perhaps thats why 'mechanical' operations appeals to the old (as myself). Pull a cable, a lever moves up or down. Roll on a throttle with a cable and it opens and closes a plunger that lets the right amount of atomized fuel-air mixture to ignite and make yer engine go "boom-boom, brap brap".......but yank on a fly-by-wire throttle and WTF knows what signals are being sent to the engine.
Such is life............they put old horses to pasture still don't they?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pvster View Post
That was in reference to cam less engines. The technology is really coming up and will be quite amazing. Actuators doing all the lifting will unlock a lot of new designs and add potential. They may even allow for multiple engine designs to be merged and reap the benefits of both designs.

While I hate how computerized engines have become, there's no going back.

VintageHunter
Location: Shambhala
"always looking for that next find".
1984 Yamaha Seca 400
1984 Honda CB125
1987 Yamaha RZ350
Various Yamaha YSR50, YSR200, YSR80
1986 Honda 500 Interceptor
1998 Yamaha R1 (first original R1)
2006 Kawasaki Ninja 250
1997 Kawasaki ZX7
1989 Honda GT650 Hawk
1989 Honda CB-1
2007 Honda 919
2001 Honda CBR F4i

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