We Need to be Seen! - Wrist Twisters
 
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post #1 of 30 Old 02-17-2007, 01:09 PM Thread Starter
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We Need to be Seen!

I am real impressed when I learned that 38% of two-vehicle MC accident deaths were where a cager turned left in front of a bike. I knew it was common but 38% - OMG drivers are blind!!! Too many lives are being lost.

The document that jclong74 found was real educational.
http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pdf/nrd...yclesTSF05.pdf

So I have convinced myself that a headlight modulator is an essential add-on. My only question here is which one to get. The two I am looking at are ones from comagination.com and kisanrtech.com. Signal dynamics looks too big and complicated.
I see with a search that dream247919 uses the Kisan, but I’m leaning toward the Comagination cuz it is half the price. You can get both the headlight and tail light modulators for $85. Anyone out there using the Comagination?

Any other ideas or solutions??
Thanks, Mark

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post #2 of 30 Old 02-17-2007, 01:22 PM
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Mark, WebBikeWorld has some good info. on this subject. Front and rear modulation is a good idea.
http://www.webbikeworld.com/lights/

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post #3 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 03:33 AM
 
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Any other ideas or solutions??
Thanks, Mark
Yep, never put your safety into something like a headlight modulator. Ride in such a way that you do not have to be seen to be safe. In other words, take control of your safety, have an escape plan for every car on the road that might do something stupid like turn left in front of you.

So, in summation. Don't require visibility to be safe. YOU are in control, not everyone else on the road. Ride like you are invisible. And don't put yourself in a position where that cage HAS to see you.

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post #4 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 04:20 AM
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Headlight modulators cause almost as much debate as oil and ABS. Many riders are big fans and believe in them. But there are other riders that have removed them because they got harassed after following cops and cagers and I know at least one person who got cut off by a left turning cage -- the cager thought the rider had light-flashed her to go ahead.

I agree with mudarra - practice defensive riding and always have an escape plan.

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post #5 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 04:37 AM
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hmm, Haven't posted in a quite a while, as far as the modulators go in FL, Most of the police won't harrass you for them as they do see them as a safe feature, having actually just spoken with an officer about them, it really depends on your attitude if pulled, and thiers... as it is considered easily in the books just like the modulators in police cruiser headlights.. that flash between high and low, which is reserved for emergency vehicles only... He even told me that it has caused confusion with older cagers, assuming it is a signal, but believes they are much better than a steady burn.... personally, I don't use one, but have thought about it.. I wonder if this issue has come up in DOT law courts before???

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post #6 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 07:11 AM
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This is an interesting topic. I would certainly not dismiss the modulators, but would agree to not relying on them only to protect yourself.

As shocking as this might sound, sometimes, a stupid driver is just that - stupid and will cut you off and at times the room for error / correction is not available. Certainly learn defensive riding - learn how to brake hard without dumping the bike. Even mentally or role play falling off a bike - when you watch a lot of experienced racers, you can actually see them tucking or protecting limbs while in a fall. Sounds crazy I know... but you can actually acquire such skills.

Though I did not have a modulator on my bike, I used to flick between high and low beams when going between cars. In my experience - cars actually swerved away from me. So... in my case, I defend modulators.

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post #7 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 07:22 AM
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I would agree with WIM on this one. Learn defensive driving, rely on it to keep you safe on the road, but use safety measures to make yourself more visible. Personally I will not use a modulator; I have enough problems with road-rage cagers without trying to piss them off more with a modulator.

-Joe
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post #8 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by hooker_47 View Post
I would agree with WIM on this one. Learn defensive driving, rely on it to keep you safe on the road, but use safety measures to make yourself more visible. Personally I will not use a modulator; I have enough problems with road-rage cagers without trying to piss them off more with a modulator.
+1 Lots of cagers wouldn't even know what the heck to think of a headlight modulator if they saw one. A confused cager just means a less attentive cager. I'll stick to wearing bright red gear with reflective strips and piping.

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post #9 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Bock919 View Post
I'll stick to wearing bright red gear with reflective strips and piping.
...and resembling a barber pole

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post #10 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudarra View Post
Yep, never put your safety into something like a headlight modulator. Ride in such a way that you do not have to be seen to be safe. In other words, take control of your safety, have an escape plan for every car on the road that might do something stupid like turn left in front of you.

So, in summation. Don't require visibility to be safe. YOU are in control, not everyone else on the road. Ride like you are invisible. And don't put yourself in a position where that cage HAS to see you.


Ya, this is pretty Golden. Good job mudarra!

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post #11 of 30 Old 02-19-2007, 08:40 AM
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I rode in Italy for three years a while back and drivers there flashed their lights to signal for you NOT to cross their path.
Once I learned this, I really liked it. Cars would overtake trucks on two-lane roads and when they saw that the oncoming traffic might pose a problem, they'd flash their headlights and the cars with the right-of-way (if there IS such a thing) would move over on to the shoulder avoiding a head-on.
I believe everyone knew it was a violation of vehicle codes to overtake a vehicle without proper room (again, if there ARE any!), but self preservation always took precedence and I really grew to enjoy the way that all drivers were using the same type of system for signaling to each other besides the horn.
I used a yellow bulb there to distinguish myself from traffic and believed that at least in some small way, it helped. I’d like to be able to use one here in the U.S., but the DOT Nazi’s wouldn’t allow it. Besides, the “ride as though you’re invisible” method is the best way to save your hide.
I’ve considered a modulator, especially after Kahuna’s death, but am still on the fence.

I plan to die young, as late as possible.
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post #12 of 30 Old 02-20-2007, 11:16 PM
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Man, I didn't even know this was a hot item of debate?! I just posted several days ago on Dream's thread how I thought these things were awesome (and I still do).
There's no arguing that riding defensively, and being in control are key factors to being safe; but I don't understand the argument that having a modulator does no good. It's not like we're ONLY relying on a modulator. I don't think anyone is claiming that the use of a modulator is the sole means of being safe on the road. It's an accessory that helps curb the odds in your favor, IN ADDITION to having a safety-first, be in control attitude. In fact, IMHO, installing a modulator IS an additional method of taking control (in a pro-active and passive way). I don't see how it can hurt to have one?

I honestly don't understand these "safety debates" that go on between riders. I swear, everytime there's an argument against an issue, the "against" camp, for some reason or other, presumes that THAT particular issue is the SOLE factor the "pro" camp will be relying on for safety. Being safe can be a multitude of items from riding in control to headlight modulators, and yes......LOUD PIPES

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post #13 of 30 Old 02-21-2007, 03:27 AM
 
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Man, I didn't even know this was a hot item of debate?! I just posted several days ago on Dream's thread how I thought these things were awesome (and I still do).
There's no arguing that riding defensively, and being in control are key factors to being safe; but I don't understand the argument that having a modulator does no good. It's not like we're ONLY relying on a modulator. I don't think anyone is claiming that the use of a modulator is the sole means of being safe on the road. It's an accessory that helps curb the odds in your favor, IN ADDITION to having a safety-first, be in control attitude. In fact, IMHO, installing a modulator IS an additional method of taking control (in a pro-active and passive way). I don't see how it can hurt to have one?

I honestly don't understand these "safety debates" that go on between riders. I swear, everytime there's an argument against an issue, the "against" camp, for some reason or other, presumes that THAT particular issue is the SOLE factor the "pro" camp will be relying on for safety. Being safe can be a multitude of items from riding in control to headlight modulators, and yes......LOUD PIPES
I didn't think it was a hot debate. I think the (only) downside to a modulator is that it will confuse some drivers, that's not saying that it will confuse ALL drivers. I'd rather not take that chance, as I frequently ride through four way stops, and can see where an un-alert cager would see that as a signal to go.
I personally find them distracting. If you've ever been on a group ride in front of a bike that has them, you will know what I mean.

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post #14 of 30 Old 02-21-2007, 04:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob919 View Post
Man, I didn't even know this was a hot item of debate?! I just posted several days ago on Dream's thread how I thought these things were awesome (and I still do).
There's no arguing that riding defensively, and being in control are key factors to being safe; but I don't understand the argument that having a modulator does no good. It's not like we're ONLY relying on a modulator. I don't think anyone is claiming that the use of a modulator is the sole means of being safe on the road. It's an accessory that helps curb the odds in your favor, IN ADDITION to having a safety-first, be in control attitude. In fact, IMHO, installing a modulator IS an additional method of taking control (in a pro-active and passive way). I don't see how it can hurt to have one?

I honestly don't understand these "safety debates" that go on between riders. I swear, everytime there's an argument against an issue, the "against" camp, for some reason or other, presumes that THAT particular issue is the SOLE factor the "pro" camp will be relying on for safety. Being safe can be a multitude of items from riding in control to headlight modulators, and yes......LOUD PIPES
I wasn't really trying to start a debate either; I just pointed out that some people here in San Antonio seem to drive with a chip on their shoulder (at least the areas I have to ride through to get to work), so I don't want to give them another reason to make life hell for me. I ride like I'm invisible to everyone, and try to stay out of everyone's way. Also, I think they are confusing and annoying as well. Just my opinion though.

-Joe
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post #15 of 30 Old 02-21-2007, 08:31 AM
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Yeah, I can see how they can get annoying to both cagers and riders (in a group ride, especially). I didn't even think about that when I bought them. I was thinking more on the lines that I wanted to be certain cagers saw me, and would therefore avoid and/or be alert to me. I guess it affects different people in different ways. When I first saw them in use, I was in my cage, and I saw it from a distance. It definitely caught my attention since I had not seen it before (this may indicate to some extent what a loner I am when I go riding ), and my immediate impression was "Holy sh*t! What a great idea!" So I went to the dealer just down the road and inquired, and came out $150+/- less and a new modulator for my bike.

I will have to be a little more conscious when I ride, especially when I'm at a red light behind a cage. The modulation goes off when you switch to Low beam, and only works in High beam. So if I was in a group ride, I would need to switch to low, which should be fine since I'm in a group anyways, which is hard for any cager to miss.

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post #16 of 30 Old 02-21-2007, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooker_47 View Post
I have enough problems with road-rage cagers without trying to piss them off more with a modulator.
I could definitely see your point in that! Especially here in road rage Houston!!

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post #17 of 30 Old 02-22-2007, 04:01 PM
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Sunday I saw a RoW violating van left hand turning van clean out a Motorcyclist! The only issue I debate about HL modulators, considering rampant cell phone and other lousy cage driving habits, is how long I would survive without one! BE SEEN!

<peaceful voice on>
Road rage takes two parties to escalate a situation. Never react to rude folks and remain curteous.
>off>

BTW Kisan's modulator turns off in Low beam and at night! (level is programmable!).

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post #18 of 30 Old 02-22-2007, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dream247919 View Post
Road rage takes two parties to escalate a situation. Never react to rude folks and remain curteous.
About two weeks ago I was minding my own business when a busted up white supply van with three guys in it tried to hit me twice. I did nothing to provoke them, and made a fast move down a side street to avoid a third try. Maybe they were just trying to scare me, but the definitely were a bunch of a**holes. I did nothing to escalate the situation. Road rage can happen anytime, anywhere, for NO REASON AT ALL. Ride safe everyone.

-Joe
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post #19 of 30 Old 02-22-2007, 05:08 PM
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I use HID lights and OEM runninglights w/ clear lenses... Works great!

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post #20 of 30 Old 02-22-2007, 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted by hooker_47 View Post
About two weeks ago I was minding my own business when a busted up white supply van with three guys in it tried to hit me twice. I did nothing to provoke them, and made a fast move down a side street to avoid a third try. Maybe they were just trying to scare me, but the definitely were a bunch of a**holes. I did nothing to escalate the situation. Road rage can happen anytime, anywhere, for NO REASON AT ALL. Ride safe everyone.
That's completely insane! Next time get the plate and call it in.
Great job being alert and avoiding their assault!

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post #21 of 30 Old 02-23-2007, 04:35 AM
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Originally Posted by dream247919 View Post
Next time get the plate and call it in.
I thought about that about 5 minutes after my heart rate slowed down. I felt like I was part of some CIA movie or something, except the agents in black suits and an unmarked car were played by white trash in wife-beaters driving a broken down service van...

-Joe
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post #22 of 30 Old 02-24-2007, 08:06 AM
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Hooker!!!!! Duuuuuuuuuuuude!

Being the forward thinker I am (as long as I don't pay attention to the voices in my head) and being the right handed shooter that I am, I decided on getting a right and a left Uncle Mikes shoulder holster for my 45's. Everyone knows you don't want to lose your throttle hand during a rolling gunfight, so I picked up the lefty rig for such occasions. Remember not to get mad when drawing down on a set of white-trashers in a beat up service van. You don't want to be accused of road rage if you don't have to be. Let them catch the lead and the road rage citation. Don't let them ever take away your sense of humor and justice.

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post #23 of 30 Old 02-25-2007, 05:44 PM
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Yesterday a rude DSL cager was tailgaiting me in the rain. My next mod is an electricalconnection turn signal to brake/running light conversion and modulator!

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post #24 of 30 Old 02-27-2007, 08:10 PM Thread Starter
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After watching this thread for a week I'd guess there are not many riders actually using modulators. But those that do, swear by them.
When the season starts I'm going to have one of each; a headlight and brake light modulator. (I really think at night that the brake light thing will at least let me not have to manually pulse my brakes at most stop lights.)
I am a defensive rider and will not abandon good practices but distracted cagers can still get any of us at any time.

It's still cold in Detroit,
Mark

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post #25 of 30 Old 02-27-2007, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark919 View Post
After watching this thread for a week I'd guess there are not many riders actually using modulators. But those that do, swear by them.
When the season starts I'm going to have one of each; a headlight and brake light modulator. (I really think at night that the brake light thing will at least let me not have to manually pulse my brakes at most stop lights.)
I am a defensive rider and will not abandon good practices but distracted cagers can still get any of us at any time.
Every long time motorcyclist has had RoW violator experiences. The modulators won't always save you, but they surely increase your survival odds. Many of the horrific nightime accidents are not from the initial fall but being hit by inattentive tailgaters. Lighting encourages safety space, but you can only rely on your SKILL.

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post #26 of 30 Old 03-18-2007, 08:13 AM
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Check out my thread on this safety mod!

https://www.wristtwisters.com/forum/s...ead.php?t=5177

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post #27 of 30 Old 03-18-2007, 08:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark919 View Post
After watching this thread for a week I'd guess there are not many riders actually using modulators. But those that do, swear by them.
When the season starts I'm going to have one of each; a headlight and brake light modulator. (I really think at night that the brake light thing will at least let me not have to manually pulse my brakes at most stop lights.)
I am a defensive rider and will not abandon good practices but distracted cagers can still get any of us at any time.

It's still cold in Detroit,
Mark
Which HLM did you get? I bought a second H4 HLM Kisan for a friend's Bday and he loves it!

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post #28 of 30 Old 03-18-2007, 08:15 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dream247919 View Post
Which HLM did you get? I bought a second H4 HLM Kisan for a friend's Bday and he loves it!
I decided on the comagination package; both HLM and Brake. I'll be ordering this week. Just trying to pace my spending...
http://www.comagination.com/

The lack of comments make me think I'll be the first on the block with this brand but I like the simplicity and the lower price.

Mark

Still freezing in Detroit

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post #29 of 30 Old 03-18-2007, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark919 View Post
I decided on the comagination package; both HLM and Brake. I'll be ordering this week. Just trying to pace my spending...
http://www.comagination.com/

The lack of comments make me think I'll be the first on the block with this brand but I like the simplicity and the lower price.

Mark

Still freezing in Detroit
Keep us posted I'm liking the price!

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post #30 of 30 Old 03-19-2007, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark919 View Post
I decided on the comagination package; both HLM and Brake. I'll be ordering this week. Just trying to pace my spending...
http://www.comagination.com/

The lack of comments make me think I'll be the first on the block with this brand but I like the simplicity and the lower price.

Mark

Still freezing in Detroit
I prefer Kisan's brake modulator microcontroller coded exponential decay. Fast at the start then slower over 4s. The competition is using a simple less effective RLC/555 timer circuit. Be aware of Kisan's brake modulator power limits 100HD (75W) which is fine for my ~90 LEDs, for 100W they offer 200HD. Great engineers aren't cheap, and you get what you pay for.

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