Baz Crash at Sepang. - Wrist Twisters
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 20 Old 02-02-2016, 10:13 AM Thread Starter
"Whose ABBA ZABBA?"
 
Bigdaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Goleta, California
Posts: 17,128
Rep Power: 1
 
Baz Crash at Sepang.

At a Buck Eighty.




“In my opinion, the M1 rifle is the greatest battle implement ever devised.”
General George S. Patton
Bigdaa is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 20 Old 02-02-2016, 11:02 AM
Cornicen
 
gibbonater's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 594
Rep Power: 1
 
Yikes. Those guys are nuts. He probably got up, got a new suit and got on a new bike 10 mins later.

Bikes:
2004 V-Rod (sold)
2004 CBR600F4i (sold)
2003 RC51
2010 Triump Scrambler (sold)
2003 CB900F
2004 CBR 600rr

Non Bikes:
2007 JK Sahara
2005 CTS V (sold)
2006 Audi S4
gibbonater is offline  
post #3 of 20 Old 02-03-2016, 08:03 AM
Dead Wrong
 
Effe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 383
Rep Power: 1
 
Garage
Too hard on the brakes?

Dead wrong
Effe is offline  
 
post #4 of 20 Old 02-03-2016, 10:01 AM Thread Starter
"Whose ABBA ZABBA?"
 
Bigdaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Goleta, California
Posts: 17,128
Rep Power: 1
 
I suspect the rear tire blew and I don't think it was braking related.
That's my seat of the pants estimation leastways.

“In my opinion, the M1 rifle is the greatest battle implement ever devised.”
General George S. Patton
Bigdaa is offline  
post #5 of 20 Old 02-03-2016, 11:27 AM
TEXAN
 
MF1VE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Midland, TX
Posts: 1,524
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigdaa View Post
I suspect the rear tire blew and I don't think it was braking related.
That's my seat of the pants estimation leastways.
That's what I read and also how it looks in the video. Tire blew on the front straight.

MF1VE is offline  
post #6 of 20 Old 02-03-2016, 01:01 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
180mph get-off = bruised elbow
So what kind of gear was he wearing??

That is some extremely lucky stuff. Yikes

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #7 of 20 Old 02-03-2016, 01:23 PM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
Reminds me of Barry Sheene's huge high speed getoff at Daytona many years ago, when his rear tire came apart in a rather dramatic way.
Sheene wore the gear of the day and was severely messed up.
Today we see Baz getting off some 30 mph slower, and being able to walk back, and nonchalantly chat up the getoff with others, complete with hands on his hips.
Mind boggling...................

mcromo44 is offline  
post #8 of 20 Old 02-04-2016, 03:24 PM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
I see I got things screwed up a bit.
Barry was doing 175 mph
Baz was doing 290 kph not 250 so was doing 180 mph, in other words about 10 mph faster than Barry when he had to get off.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #9 of 20 Old 02-04-2016, 09:59 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
Still.. those speeds. How long ago was the Barry get-off at Daytona? Ah found it '75. Yup definite advancements in gear but the crashes were somewhat different. One being out of a corner and one at a more predictable straight (if such thing exists at 180mph slide).

https://youtu.be/W2m16HvLdGk
"A millisecond of fear."

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #10 of 20 Old 02-05-2016, 08:23 AM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewebay1 View Post
Still.. those speeds. How long ago was the Barry get-off at Daytona? Ah found it '75. Yup definite advancements in gear but the crashes were somewhat different. One being out of a corner and one at a more predictable straight (if such thing exists at 180mph slide).

https://youtu.be/W2m16HvLdGk
"A millisecond of fear."
Keep in mind that those 1975 leathers were single layer with doubling on the joints and absolutely no armour of any kind. My Lewis suit, which I still have, also had a very thin layer of foam between the two layers of leather under the bum.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #11 of 20 Old 02-05-2016, 01:22 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
Incredible. No padding and single stitch. I wouldn't get near a track without at least level 1 CE armor, preferably level 2 for the back, shoulders, elbows, and knees at min.

I think some of the textile stuff today would perform better than leathers from the 70s, thinking about it.

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #12 of 20 Old 02-05-2016, 01:48 PM
Left of Centre
 
K1w1Boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Auckland, NZ
Posts: 3,505
Rep Power: 1
 
K1w1Boy is offline  
post #13 of 20 Old 02-05-2016, 04:31 PM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewebay1 View Post
Incredible. No padding and single stitch. I wouldn't get near a track without at least level 1 CE armor, preferably level 2 for the back, shoulders, elbows, and knees at min.

I think some of the textile stuff today would perform better than leathers from the 70s, thinking about it.
Armoured textile yes, but textile vs good leather and craftmanship of that era, no.

For the last ever event at the now closed Calgary Race City, I pulled out the ancient 1975 Lewis Leathers riding gear as part of the fun. Managed to get them on and zip them up. They cut the air so well that 6th pulled like 5th at the top, as compared to my fully armoured current era leathers. But I sure wouldn't want to fall off in them and take the hits inherent with the old school stuff. Pulling on the old stuff gives you a feeling of being naked and totally unprotected. Real nice leather body suit !
I had one big off and one small off back in them, in the 70s, both on a track. Aside from seriously trashing one arm all I ever got was bumps and bruises. Looking back, I guess I was fairly lucky.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #14 of 20 Old 02-05-2016, 08:59 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
I'm finding it hard to believe around 3 psi would have saved that tire (24.6psi min vs 21.75 - 23 psi what the team was running)... I'm no expert though and never played below 28psi on street tires.

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #15 of 20 Old 02-06-2016, 11:14 AM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewebay1 View Post
I'm finding it hard to believe around 3 psi would have saved that tire (24.6psi min vs 21.75 - 23 psi what the team was running)... I'm no expert though and never played below 28psi on street tires.
You raise a very interesting point.

Perhaps the public info is not absolutely correct and the actual pressure setting was lower, keeping in mind we're also reading that there was a Michelin tire guy in their pit, and whatever the actual pressure was, was not a team only setting that Michelin was not aware of.

In addition, I have to wonder if there is some inflection point on the pressure setting curve, that results in a revised temperature rise curve and ultimate peak temperature.
The same thing might hold re the carcass flex, keeping in mind the carcass will have a "stiffness curve" as relates to displacement, frequency and temperature at the least.
Look at it this way, the tires are a ragged edge design servile to a host of parameters, some being mass, 4th moment of inertia, grip in various planes, and adequate stability (= acceptable instability). Reduced pressure increases carcass flex which in term increases temp as the flex energy gets transformed to heat energy. The chassis guy and the rider want more forward drive grip and sidewall deformation for lean grip, which a less stiff carcass provides, as can be realized by reduced pressure settings. Perhaps the range of problematic temperature rise and/or problematic/destructive carcass flexure starts at a low pressure point that would surprise us IF we were ever able to find out from Michelin. (same concept would hold re any of the racing tires regardless of the supplier)

By the way, Sheene's 1975 crash was in effect to unwitting and unintended destructive testing of the Dunlop slick rear of the day. Very painful way for Sheene to unintentionally provide Dunlop with a discovery of what they simply did not priorly know.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #16 of 20 Old 02-06-2016, 07:26 PM
(-(-(-(-(- -)-)-)-)-)
 
andrewebay1's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 6,883
Rep Power: 1
 
Odd..tough to point the finger if the team guys and Michelin rep all knew pressures being ran. Not sure why Michelin would then even make the point of calling those pressure numbers when they're false, trade secrets? All for the sake of the investigations maybe and finger pointing isn't as necessary since no harm came to the rider?

My classified(s):
Nothing at the moment

----------------
------------
---------
------
---
- '96 Race-retired GSXR 750 (Sold)
- '01 RC51 SP1 (Sold)
- '03 919

"Security is mostly a superstition, it does not exist in nature: avoiding danger in the long run is no safer than outright being exposed. Life is either a daring adventure or nothing."-Helen Keller
andrewebay1 is offline  
post #17 of 20 Old 02-07-2016, 08:30 AM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
Ditto, and now MotoGP Class is implementing tire pressures as being required data logging meaning that sensors will have to be installed.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #18 of 20 Old 02-09-2016, 11:22 AM
(Quintus) Pilus Prior
 
badmoon692008's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Neenah, WI
Posts: 2,222
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Extraordinary Ride 
Total Awards: 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcromo44 View Post
Ditto, and now MotoGP Class is implementing tire pressures as being required data logging meaning that sensors will have to be installed.
Have they for sure implemented that? I know there was talk of it in the past and the tire manufacturers shot it down, and there was talk of bringing it back up but I haven't seen anything concrete

Love is the feeling you get when you like something as much as your motorcycle - Hunter S. Thompson
I just mı̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̨ade you wipe your screen.
-2009 Suzuki GSX-R 750 Race Bike
-2007 Honda 919
-1995 Nighthawk 750 (Tboned)
-1983 KZ 440 (Sold)
badmoon692008 is offline  
post #19 of 20 Old 02-09-2016, 11:56 AM
McTavish
 
mcromo44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 5,655
Rep Power: 1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by badmoon692008 View Post
Have they for sure implemented that? I know there was talk of it in the past and the tire manufacturers shot it down, and there was talk of bringing it back up but I haven't seen anything concrete
My understanding is that it has been ruled on, is being implemented, but will have to wait until the data logging systems are in place.
In other words, there is to be rules imposed data logging of MotoGP, and the tire pressure monitoring will be incorporated into that.
I think it might be Moto2 that already has data logging tire pressures and not just pre track entry manual checking and data entry of it.

mcromo44 is offline  
post #20 of 20 Old 02-11-2016, 09:22 AM
LDH
Test Rider
 
LDH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: by the ocean
Posts: 4,360
Rep Power: 1
 

Awards Showcase
Trackday Recognition Referral Award 
Total Awards: 2

Tire carcass delamination due to incorrect tire pressure is not really uncommon even at the pro level. They will try anything and everything to get an advantage and some times it does not work.

When the MotoGP spec tire rule was adopted in 2008 and Bridgestone became the supplier they had issues along the way even some serious ones as recent as 2013. Now that Michelin is the Spec Tire supplier for the first time in 8 years they will have some hurdles to jump as well here & there, but I am hesitant to say that this instance with Baz was their fault.

LDH is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Wrist Twisters forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










« Ice | Suter MMX 500 »
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome