(Flame suit on)... I searched and tried finding something that I need some rookie help with.
X-ring...O-ring... etc.
I am not looking to race my bike and change out chain/sprocket due to weight after each weekend at the track. I am looking for a factory, or better sprocket set and chain that offers good longevity, durability... and if I can get something that looks better than cast iron, great... but I have not heard good things about some of the light weight alum. sets... and what does and X ring or O ring have over the other?
Yep, I know... rookie question, but I bet I could school all of you in the linear & torque dynamics of a properly fitted golf shaft. So, help me out.
If you want someting thats going to last a long time and look good, then check out the Stealth sprocket from Supersprox. In my opinion, X-ring is better than O-ring and D.I.D. is the way to go. Check Sprocket Center, Drive Systems USA Inc. , Supersprox USA and give LDH at Dan Kyle's a call as well.
Oh by the way, I just happen to be a linear torque Dynamicist....small world, isn't it!
hasbeen nailed it. DID x-ring chain is the shit. gold plated but meh, what the heck. looks good on the 9er i believe. running the 17/45 combo and lovin it as well.
If you want someting thats going to last a long time and look good, then check out the Stealth sprocket from Supersprox. In my opinion, X-ring is better than O-ring and D.I.D. is the way to go. Check Sprocket Center, Drive Systems USA Inc. , Supersprox USA and give LDH at Dan Kyle's a call as well.
Oh by the way, I just happen to be a linear torque Dynamicist....small world, isn't it!
+1 on Supersprox, Sprocket Center, and D.I.D. chains. I picked up this set from Sprocket Center last week...
Hasbeen nailed it. DID x-ring chain is the shit. gold plated but meh, what the heck. looks good on the 9er i believe. running the 17/45 combo and lovin it as well.
+100 Motorcyclesuperstore has them for an excellent price. The chain looks good and should last a long, long time. good luck!
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Well, fire the engines! Spur this iron space-pony on!
x-ring and steel sprockets.no mistaking their performance. and a good value. i just bought a 17 for front and stock size for rear. gold chain yep its a d.i.d . cost me about$190.00
D.I.D. ERV chain here on my ZX10R. I've got 22,000 miles on this thing and it is going strong. I will not put ANYTHING but D.I.D.'s on any of my motorcycles.
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ok, so here's a question for the group then: how long or how many miles would you go without replacing the chain? is it strictly a matter of when the chain gets stretched out or the sprockets get worn, or are there other factors?
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__________________
Well, fire the engines! Spur this iron space-pony on!
ok, so here's a question for the group then: how long or how many miles would you go without replacing the chain? is it strictly a matter of when the chain gets stretched out or the sprockets get worn, or are there other factors?
.
I got 24,000 miles from my stock ZX10R chain. I take good care of these things. It is most important that I feel confident when pouring the coals to the motor. I imagine I will ride this chain until I see stuck links that won't work loose or shredded pieces of x-ring start sticking out like split ends. I really did and do not have too much trouble with stretch here because I don't burn out or drag race. I may see 30,000 miles or more and this is with a bike that has a bunch of HP stock AND a full Akro Ti and PCIII. I have a trick to loosen stuck links. I'll see if I can make a chicken scratch picture of the easy procedure.
__________________
Quote of the Year
"One would think that the Secret Service was smart enough to get serviced secretly."
I got 24K on my '07 919 stock chain too. I replaced the chain & sprockets when it went into the red zone. DID X-ring and steel sprockets. Be interesting to see how long this one lasts. I installed an oiler at the same time as the replacement and have only had to adjust it once in 9K miles.
My chain has no stuck links and I'm not sure of the actual mileage on it since I'm not the original owner, but my bike is sitting at 29,xxx miles. The chain has gone from staying properly adjusted to getting loose between cleanings. Even when adjusted properly, it has enough side to side play to easily touch the rear tire, also, if I pull on the very back of the chain where it is most wrapped and it pulls away about half a tooth depth or more.
EDIT: The rollers are starting to make more noise and are kinds getting a polished look too. Don't really know if that means anything, but I'd assume it means the rollers are getting polished by sliding across the sprocket where the teeth are worn.
Murph, if you grab the rollers and they move on their little tiny "axles" (pins) Bye Bye chain. Examine the sealing rings, also. They may be shedding material and this is a sure sign that they've reached the end.
__________________
Quote of the Year
"One would think that the Secret Service was smart enough to get serviced secretly."
I'll check out the chain in a little more detail, but I'm pretty sure it must be the OEM chain from 29,xxx miles ago. It has DID stamped on the links, but is plain steel color instead of gold.
After looking over the photos on this site and on the web, the rear sprocket looks stock as well. Maybe the previous owner replaced it, but I don't know. I'm good about cleaning it every big ride or every 500 miles (whichever comes first) but it has at least 15,xxx miles on it. Maybe I suck at cleaning it.
New chain and sprockets are on the shelf just waiting for installation.
That site will replace the sprocket if you ever wear it out. They can powdercoat them any color, too, but usually come in black.
Quoting their site: "Certain hybrid, project machines with engine transplants; mega horsepower dune dragsters; machines with non-standard gearing; custom-made sprockets, conversion kits, and machines using non-Sidewinder drive chains can still be covered under the Lifetime guarantee."
That site will replace the sprocket if you ever wear it out. They can powdercoat them any color, too, but usually come in black.
Quoting their site: "Certain hybrid, project machines with engine transplants; mega horsepower dune dragsters; machines with non-standard gearing; custom-made sprockets, conversion kits, and machines using non-Sidewinder drive chains can still be covered under the Lifetime guarantee."
That's a pretty good guarantee!
Didn't even know Ti sprockets were available.
__________________
Quote of the Year
"One would think that the Secret Service was smart enough to get serviced secretly."
That's some website. It's the worst one I've seen in years. It is screaming of high school HTML student. The site being that unprofessional makes me want to run away from an otherwise completely awesome product.
(Flame suit on)... I searched and tried finding something that I need some rookie help with.
X-ring...O-ring... etc.
I am not looking to race my bike and change out chain/sprocket due to weight after each weekend at the track. I am looking for a factory, or better sprocket set and chain that offers good longevity, durability... and if I can get something that looks better than cast iron, great... but I have not heard good things about some of the light weight alum. sets... and what does and X ring or O ring have over the other?
Yep, I know... rookie question, but I bet I could school all of you in the linear & torque dynamics of a properly fitted golf shaft. So, help me out.
Attempting to address the questions that you asked (good ones, BTW):
1) Sealed chain (o-ring v x-ring, etc.): The goal here is to retain the lubrication where it's needed. The o-ring was the original iteration (someone looked at the chain and thought, "Hey, why not just stick a little gasket around the pins, between the plates and/or the rollers?"). Good idea, and it's worked well toward that purpose. Later came the idea of the x-ring (still a toroid, but X-shaped in cross section--see illustration above). The x-ring maintains the lubrication seal with less friction, as the contact area is reduced. Note that there is no magic or voodoo involved, and you still need to be vigilant about regular chain maintenance and lubrication. In fact, some mechanics are of the opinion that a non-sealed chain is actually a better performer IF you are HYPERVIGILANT about chain maintenance (much more than most of us are willing to do).
As for real world durability for the 919, Occam's Razor is just as valid here as anywhere: spend the $$$ for a top quality chain (as others have said, D.I.D. is about as good or better than just about anything out there), but don't waste your money on overkill. Specifically: there are some premium chains out there that DO have a higher tensile strength, but note that this higher tensile strength does not necessarily translate into a longer lasting chain; unless, for example, you're running NOS and drag racing every weekend.
2) Steel v Aluminum rear sprockets: for an engineer this should be a no-brainer. Hardened steel will wear longer, period. Aluminum sprockets are frequently reported to give up the ghost in as little as 4K miles. The advantage is of course weight reduction, with the subsequent increase in acceleration. But if we're being honest, the 9'er is just not enough of a true sport bike that you'd ever really notice a difference (except possibly on a track day). Now if you go for a 520 chain conversion kit with an aluminum rear sprocket (~4# lighter chain), you may notice a difference. But again, long-range durability will be less. As for the Stealth sprockets: neat idea, and they ARE eye candy, but again come with a premium 2x $$$ that does not translate into FUNCTION. Further, a quick google search will turn up a number of end-user reports of out-of round Stealth sprockets, and reports of premature failure (cracks and loose rivets--rare, but they're out there). Once again, if reliability is your goal, Occam's Razor applies: one-piece hardened steel v. three different metals and SEVEN different pieces in a single critical drive component--which appeals to your inner engineer???
Good primer on chain maintenance, replacement, etc.:
The folks @ Sprocket Center are great. They'll shoot straight with ya, and won't try to sell you something that you don't really need.
While you're changing out chains/sprockets anyway, you might want to change up the final gear ratio with a different front/rear sprocket combination. There's a LOT of info on this topic here, but briefly: stock ratio=16F/43R= 2.69; >2.69=quicker acceleration, lower top speed, higher RPM for a given speed; < 2.69= lower RPM for given speed, less "buzz" @ highway speed, possibly improved MPG, less acceleration, and more accurate speedometer (if you're not running a Speedo-Healer). On the 919 it's easy to experiment and find one that works best for you.
Here is a fun site to play with: you can plug in whatever sprocket and chain parameters you want, and it will calculate and compare ratios, speeds, and RPM's for all gears. There's even a section that calculates chain wear--
That's some website. It's the worst one I've seen in years. It is screaming of high school HTML student. The site being that unprofessional makes me want to run away from an otherwise completely awesome product.
Yeah! You like that? Did you have your speakers on? (yes, they stream audio on the front page - )
This just came up on another forum a few days ago.
We weighed a Stealth Sprocket here at the shop the other day in the 530 size & it weighed more than the OEM Steel Sprocket!!!! Totally ghey if you ask me to spend that kind of money to decrease the performance of your bike...
I came this far I might as well go ahead & cut/paste the other key points from the other forum too
When you switch to a 520 conversion kit with aluminum sprockets you are saving about 4lbs of rotating mass compared to a stock 530 chain & steel sprocket set-up. That is A LOT of weight when it comes to gyroscopic precession and you can feel the difference as well as see it on the dyno.
Vortex sprockets are cheap shit and always have been. Even their newer ones that are hard anodized are still crappy.
Renthal sprockets are expensive shit
The best on the market is the older AFAM sprockets that were hard anodized in the gray color with the teflon impregnation, but they are getting very difficult to find. The newer AFAM stuff hard anodized in Black or the Greenish color are still way better than most, but they don't wear as good as the grey ones did
For chains I've been using the DID ERV3 520 chain for years. It is the strongest, lightest 520 chain I have used and it holds up better than anything else on the market. I've used it on my RC51, GSXR K5, both 1000RR's including one with 14,000 Track Only miles on the same chain.
DID has recently come out with a brand new ZVM-X 520 chain that is rated to 1200cc's by their standards and is hailed as a "street" chain instead of a racing chain. It only weighs .3 of a lb more than the ERV3 520 and while I haven't actually used it I have sold a bunch of them and all the reports are coming back positive although it is too early to really get the full scoop on such a new product.
It wasn't much more, but it was more and the worst part is you know the extra weight is carried on the outermost part of the sprocket which exponentially increases the gyroscopic precession.
Purely as an example you can have two wheels that weigh the exact same, but if one of the wheels has more weight towards the hub rather than rim then it will have less gyroscopic precession and handle like a lighter wheel.
We now know DID x-ring is the best chain, but what would be the best brand quality/price for sprockets??
1. AFAM
2. Drive Systems
3. Sprocket Specialists Titan Tough (haven't seen these in quite a few years though)
At any rate aluminum hard anodized sprockets are relatively cheap and are designed to wear out & be replaced. Some of you guys that go on & on about how much life to expect out of your sprockets make me laugh almost as much as the poserific squids that call me and demand that their sprocket be a certain color It's a tool, not a fashion statement...
I have a Sunstar rear now, it seems in fairly good condition considering my chain (RK) is completely f**ked +/-25000km's. So I will get a AFAM front, Sunstar rear and a DID chain. Thanks for the info.
Quick question... sprocket recommendations for mainly commuting but still like some get up and go.
It seems like the 17/45 combo is good for commuting. What will the 17/44 do for me in comparison?
And what are the associated chain lengths if I want to go with the ZVMX Super Street Series chain that LDH mentioned... Is there a kit that comes with the ZVMX chain? I thought I saw a package deal just a while back and can't seem to located it on the forums now.
Thanks for the info... my stock chain is definitely ready for an upgrade!
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Temecula, CA (So Cal)
06-919
Too often we lose sight of life's simple pleasures.
Remember when someone annoys you, that it takes 42 muscles in your face to frown ...
But it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and bitch-slap that mother- upside the head...
Got the info I needed from LDH... Appreciated all the help. And he hooked me up with a nice new 520 17-44 set up. Should have the new teeth and chain on by Friday afternoon. just in time for a nice weekend ride. Weather will finally cool off a bit in SoCal so it should be great for a ride!
__________________
Temecula, CA (So Cal)
06-919
Too often we lose sight of life's simple pleasures.
Remember when someone annoys you, that it takes 42 muscles in your face to frown ...
But it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and bitch-slap that mother- upside the head...
Word of advice - If you guys purchase your sprockets or any other parts from the Kyleusa.com website use a credit card instead of PayPal.
When you use PayPal it forces you to make the payment immediately upon completion of the order with standard shipping rates and no discounts, but when you use a credit card any discounts on shipping or for forum members etc can be applied when your credit card is manually charged.
I'm going to replace my sprockets and chain in the next couple months, and am confused as hell. The stock sizes are 16f and 43r correct? What would dropping the front to 15 teeth do? What would a 15/45 do? I only do a couple longer rides each year, so don't need a gas saver sprocket combo. I like the giddy up the stock setup gives, but is there a way to get more out of it with the 15 tooth front?
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Does this napkin smell like chloroform? Just kidding baby lemme buy you a drink.
15T=wheelies, less top speed
17/44 is where its at imo. Damn near the same acceleration as stock but smoother and better rpm at speeds of 60-80
Why not 16/44 then? Wouldn't the less teeth in front give you a quicker jump off at a light? Thanks for the answer too dude, can always count on the WT to entertain my stupidity.
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Does this napkin smell like chloroform? Just kidding baby lemme buy you a drink.
I got a question, how come a chain and sprocket set with a DID 530 chain and both sprockets from sprocketcenter is under 200 bucks, but when I look at the price of the chain by itself other places the chain alone is pretty much the same price?
I'm looking at buying one of these sets within the next couple of weeks since my chain is completely toast.
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"A motorcycle is not just a two-wheeled car; the difference between driving a car and climbing onto a motorcycle is the difference between watching TV and actually living your life."
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It's a tool, not a fashion statement...
...
upside the head...
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